Well today I had an exciting time with my hive. First off I finaly saw my queen!! I was going through the hive and after a bit the girls got very agitated. I got through the top brood box and was moving the towel that I was using to cover the hive and there she was sitting in a fold of the towel!! I haven't seen her since she was first installed! I decided to mark her while I had a chance. I scooped her up into the jar that I was going to use to do a mite check and took her inside. I used some acrylic paint that I had around. she kept moving all around and every time that I tried to grab her I was afraid that I would hurt her. I managed to get the paint all over her wings and some on her back. She was crawling and squirming all over the place... I also unfortunatly got some on her head and this worries me some. She was very distressed by the time I returned her to the hive. I just felt that I needed to mark her because like I said I have not been able to find her all summer.
I also did a mite check using powdered sugar in a jar. I scooped them up then put the top on and sprinkled them liberally with powdered sugar. Then I left them for about 15 min while I dusted the entire hive. When I shook them out I got 20 mites. Seems like way too many. I am not sure if I should try somthing more aggressive or just do a lot of sugar dusting.... I have done the dusting of the hive twice in the last two months but this is the first time that I have done the shake to see how many I actually have. Any suggestions are welcome.
The hive seems very strong and healthy. I went to another beeks house about a week ago and saw her hives. she has five hives and a nuc. we opened two of the hives and lifted to feel the weight of all of them. Mine seems much more active, more bees, more brood, fatter bees, much more stores (way heavier), more aggressive too. I have been feeding them sugar syrup with honey b healthy in it and they are sucking it down like there is no tomorow. I have put in a crisco sugar patty for trachial mites and like I said I have sugar dusted the hive three times now for varoa.
I tried to load up a picture of my queen and my mite drop from the sugar shake but I have dial up and it is just moving too slow. maybe I will try to load them up tomorow.
Thanks,
Alfred
It's not good to get paint anywhere on a queen other than a small dot on her thorax. I have seen them survive bad paint jobs, but they are dangerous for the queen. You have to have her completely still to mark her.
20 from a cupful or so of bees, is a severe mite infestation. I would go for oxalic acid or some other serious control.
Alfred, having a marked queen is very handy, not just to ease finding her, but also in determining the state of the hive. Without a marked queen, you can not tell for certain if they have superceded or swarmed. I commend you for attempting to mark your queen.
Here is a short video I put together that may make it easier for you next time.
http://robo.bushkillfarms.com/2007/09/04/queen-marking/
I searched through the forum for info on oxalic acid. It looks to me like I need to wait for my hive to have a lot less brood before I treat with it. I'm guessing that I want to wait until there is almost no brood. Is there something that I can be doing now besides the powdered sugar treatments?
Thanks,
Alfred
Rob, I wanted to look at your video, but I couldn't download Adobe Flash Reader for some reason, so I couldn't look at it, too bad though. Have a wonderful and beautiful day, great life. Cindi
>I searched through the forum for info on oxalic acid. It looks to me like I need to wait for my hive to have a lot less brood before I treat with it.
I would not wait. You have a serious infestation. I would buy or make a vaporizer. If you vaporize you can treat them several times. Once now. Once a week from now and once more when there is no more brood in the hive.
> I'm guessing that I want to wait until there is almost no brood. Is there something that I can be doing now besides the powdered sugar treatments?
There are a lot of things you could do, but most of them, IMO are counterproductive. Powdered sugar works. You can cut out any drone brood.
Thanks I will look for how to make a vaporizer and do it as soon as I can. I wasn't aware that I could do more than one treatment that way.
Thanks again.
I also could not get the video to work.
Alfred
Here's one for sale:
http://members.shaw.ca/orioleln/Vaporizer.htm
I made one out of some pipe fittings and heated it with a torch.
Same place I bought my vapourizer from. $80 CDN included shipping and handling. It should be here tomorrow. I was going to order the smaller ($20 cheaper) apparatus, but the dude said the better model was superior and advised to purchase it. So I did.
By the way, I couldn't load the site that you put on the forum Michael, for whatever reason. Have a beautiful and wonderful day in our great world. Cindi
Here's a like to the video on YouTube.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R4Sb6J_uY3E (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R4Sb6J_uY3E)
I'll change the link on the site tomorrow to reflect the youtube location.
I have the JB200 electric vaporizer from the site Michael linked. I am very pleased with it and would recommend it.
Rob, I tried again to look at your video through YouTube, nope. I must be doing something seriously wrong (I have a tendency to not work well with things on the computer, hee, hee). I will wait until you post another post with the other link you are speaking about. Have a wonderful and great day on our greatest of earths. Cindi
when you vaporize oxilac -if you get the vapors to hot -they turn into formic-very hard to regulate heat with glow plug and worse with the crack pipe type of vaporizer.there are better ways to deliver formic (which is what you will end up with if it gets to hot ) Mite-away II is very easy and it is not such of a blast effect with the vapors. many people swear by vaporizing oxalic but dont realize the are actually applying formic as a result of not controlling proper temp RDY-B
RDY-B. Right.
THis company that I am purchasing the vapourizing unit from sells two types. One cheaper than the other.
One is run using a 12-volt car battery.
The second (cheaper one) uses a blow torch.
He told me that the car battery one is superior to the blow torch one because the blow torch one has such a high degree of temperature, as you were saying. He did not recommend the blow torch run one even in the slightest, and he sells both, weird. Have a wonderful and beautiful day. Cindi
Cindi I thought you where a fan of formic why are you buying something to deliver oxilac. 8-) if you want to do oxilac best to trickel (but im not for it but it is best) just ask finman ;) RDY-B
I hope you are not caught up in that craziness and are going to vaporize propels are you :-D When you do the oxalic becarful and stand up wind RDY-B
RDY-B. I am a fan of formic acid and the oxalic acid trickle. Yes, I agree with you. BUT...I have been doing some research on vapourizing oxalic acid. It has some advantages over the O.A. trickle and F.A. pads.
With O.A. trickle it can only be done once a year, during the broodless period. Period.
Formic Acid is to be used only when the bees are not in the winter cluster, so therefore is temperature dependent.
O.A. vapourizing can be done any time of the year as many times as required (of course not during the honeyflow) and not when the weather dips to below freezing (or just slightly above). The vapour causes no harm whatsoever to brood.
I am an experimenter. I always keep an open mind and like to try things. The vapourizing of O.A. (and also there are some that use acetic acid (vinegar), like Charlie for vapourizing for mites) is something that I want to try out.
I know that formic and oxalic acid in the previously mentioned forms work well. But vapourizing is something that has caught my eye for this experimental part of me.
The vapourizing of O.A. is very quickly done in the hives. The hives are not opened up to interrupt them, it seems it has advantages.
Time will tell the tales. That is what I am up to, one day I will be able to say that I found the perfect plan, with regard to mite control. (without regressing the bees, as I am pretty sure that works very well for mite controls too :) So, this is me, I try things. Have a wonderful and beautiful day, best of this great life we live. Cindi
Dont have any varoa probs here yet but I did see my crazy queen the other day when I popped the top off to check a super. She was crawling around on the top bar of a frame. didnt have time to go down any further. She should have plenty of room in the bottom 2 deeps.
Quote from: alfred on October 16, 2007, 09:33:09 PM
I also could not get the video to work.
I changed my site to use the YouTube version, all should be good now. Seems something broke with the Zunibee site link.
http://robo.bushkillfarms.com/2007/09/04/queen-marking/
I downloaded the video off of utube last night. Very nice! Thanks
I will not be so timid about holding her next time I try marking.
Alfred
As I have been reading about oxalic acid I have been wondering about the residue left on the inside of the hive. I understand that everything will be coated with the stuff. Being as it is very nasty does one need to take precautions when handling the hive or frames and such after a treatment?
I also understand that there may be some condensation and crystals in the bottom of the hive does one need to treat these with extra care? Seems like very poisonous and corrosive stuff.
My plan today is to puchase pipe material and a torch to make my own vaporizor. I am doing this as much for the savings as for the fact that it seems that I need to do a treatment right away so I don't want to wait for a commercial vaporizer to arrive.
I will use two peices of pipe connected by an angle peice with a cap on the end of one that I can remove and fill with the acid crystals.
Still need to get clear on how much to use... looks like 2 grams.
Also seems to be important to heat the acid slowly in order to avoid decomposition. I know that I saw somewhere what the exact temputure range should be, but I lost it. It seems moot as I don't think that I will be able to monitor that tempuratutre anyway.
I plan to close the entrance and use the vent in my shim board at the top of the hive to insert the pipe then apply the torch to the resevoir. Any comments or advice would be appreciated.
Alfred
Finsky has very good success with the Drizzle method useing oxalic acid, maybe he will chime in and tell you how he does it........
When vaporizing, it does leave a fine white film on the frames. Since I usually vaporize as the last part of preparing for winter, I don't have to worry about it. The bees have it all cleaned up by spring when I next get into the hive. I'm sure the bees clean it up rather quickly, like a day or two.
Just as FYI, the measuring spoon they supply with the electric vaporizer is made from a 1/2 copper pipe cap with a handle soldered on. It is for 2 brood chambers.
(http://robo.hydroville.com/gallery2/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=161&g2_serialNumber=1)
My understanding is that with the drizzle method you can only do once a season whereas with the vaporizing method you can do it several times a season. This allows you to treat multiple times to cover an entire brood cycle. With the trickle method you have to have no brood at all when you treat in order to get them all. If you miss some you can't treat again for a season.
or so I understand....
Alfred
what happens if you drizel more than once??? RDY-B
>what happens if you drizel more than once??? RDY-B
My understanding is that it damages their kidneys or whatever the equivalent organ is called in a bee. :) Bottom line is they don't live very long.
Quote from: Robo on October 17, 2007, 12:33:48 PM
When vaporizing, it does leave a fine white film on the frames. Since I usually vaporize as the last part of preparing for winter, I don't have to worry about it. The bees have it all cleaned up by spring when I next get into the hive. I'm sure the bees clean it up rather quickly, like a day or two.
Just as FYI, the measuring spoon they supply with the electric vaporizer is made from a 1/2 copper pipe cap with a handle soldered on. It is for 2 brood chambers.
(http://robo.hydroville.com/gallery2/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=161&g2_serialNumber=1)
Oh brother. I see a huge issue here. I will explain. Sometimes when people see a picture, they don't read all the fine print. This picture shows a picture of a measuring cup, on the measuring cup it says 1 cup = 2 grams.
Now if I were to only look at the picture (and again, many don't read small print), I would think that the amount of oxalic acid used would be one full measuring cup (250 ml). That would be an awful lot of oxalic acid to use in a hive. On the other hand, most people would probably figure it out that it is not 1 (250) ml anount. BUT.......
The company should revamp their instructions and if I knew who the company was, I would be writing them a letter :( ;) :)
Their caption on the measuring spoon should read:
One CAPFUL = 2 gramsJust my weird nature of being a perfectionist, exact and knowing perfectly stuff. Have a wonderful and beautiful day. Cindi
Quote from: Cindi on October 18, 2007, 10:41:14 AM
The company should revamp their instructions and if I knew who the company was, I would be writing them a letter :( ;) :)
Same company you got your vaporizer from.....Did they not send you a measuring spoon too?