Last year I did no feeding in the Fall..I did however feed sugar syrup in the late Winter. The colony did fine.
I am reading how many beeks are feeding now, even a member who lives in my vicinity. I am leaving the bees most of their stores for Winter. Do I have to feed now?
Would feeding mega bee food be prudent now, or is that just for brood production in the Spring?
If the bees have plenty of honey, wouldn't they ignore the sugar syrup???
Curious Sharon, at it again!
I also have question about feeding. Just checked their syrup supply and found a couple dead bees in it. Would nosema infected bees that drown, infect the syrup and then all the bees that eat it? :?
QuoteWould feeding mega bee food be prudent now, or is that just for brood production in the Spring?
Pollen substitute provides the bees with protein. Young bees need protein to fatten up to get through winter.
QuoteIf the bees have plenty of honey, wouldn't they ignore the sugar syrup???
If they have empty cells, I think they have the need to fill them. Who knows how long winter will be. It's better to have too much than not enough.
If you feed, bees drown. With jars it's usually from leaks. With frame feeders and top feeders they drown in the syrup supply itself.
My understanding is that the only reason to feed is if the hive, for reasons either that you took too much honey or they didn't make enough, is too short on supplies for winter.
There should be no reason to feed a hive that has been left with enough honey and has appropriate stores for your part of the country to make it through the winter.
Linda T in Atlanta
I understand 'have syrup will drown' part. Do the drowned bees help spread nosema by contaminating the syrup?
Sharon,
Last year this time I did not need to feed my hives at all because they had plenty of honey for the winter. This year is a different story and I am feeding constantly until they build up enough stores.
Also my understanding regarding the pollen is if the bees are bringing in pollen(which you can watch and see) and you find a few frames in each of the hives filled up with pollen, then you do not need to give anything extra.
Sounds like you are doing great with the bees. Wonderful that you got honey this year.
What did you decide on doing for the mites??
Take care
Annette
Quote from: bmacior on October 05, 2008, 10:02:39 PM
I understand 'have syrup will drown' part. Do the drowned bees help spread nosema by contaminating the syrup?
Whenever I have found drowned bees in the syrup,, I took them out. Seems like a bad idea to just let them stay in the sugar syrup and contaminate the syrup.
Regarding the nosema part, I do not have an answer.
Thanks folks for the info...
I broke down the hives yesterday, did some consolidation. Now have the 3 colonies, 2 are comprised of 3 mediums ( 2 brood and one honey super ) and the 3rd is 2 deeps ( brood and honey )...
I closed up the SBB's and placed an Apigard on. It worked for me last year, hence I will do it again...
The bees were extremely gentle, not a one went after me...temps here are moderate. I will keep an eye on them for the need for food...so far we are ok.
Let's suppose some dead bees, who have nosema, are infecting the syrup. The least you can do is to put fumagilin in the syrup, so that any new bees getting infected are also getting treatment at the same time.
I put cider vinegar in my syrup as it is supposed to help with nosema. As far as I know, I don't have it. Was just curious.
Quote from: bmacior on October 06, 2008, 08:09:55 PM
I put cider vinegar in my syrup as it is supposed to help with nosema. As far as I know, I don't have it. Was just curious.
I add 1 tablespoon of cider vinegar per gallon of syrup when feeding and haven't had an identifiable case of nosema since 1965.
Brian, I must ask this question, you know my curious nature. Do you put the apple cider vinegar in each time you feed s.s., regardless of the time of year. Meaning, is this just a standard that you always have the apple cider vinegar as part of any feeding program? Elaborate please. Have the most wonderful and awesome day, Cindi
I've never treated for Nosema. In some locales it seems to be more of a problem than others.
http://www.bushfarms.com/beespests.htm#nosema
Quote from: Cindi on October 06, 2008, 11:42:08 PM
Brian, I must ask this question, you know my curious nature. Do you put the apple cider vinegar in each time you feed s.s., regardless of the time of year. Meaning, is this just a standard that you always have the apple cider vinegar as part of any feeding program? Elaborate please. Have the most wonderful and awesome day, Cindi
If I make syrup I put cider vinegar in it. It changes the acidity to make it more attractive to the bees and an occasional dose as a nosema treatment never hurts. If I am going to take the time to feed I want the bees to take it and the other benefits are a plus.
I thought it odd that Randy Oliver, in his test for Nosema treatments, did not include cider vinegar as one of the methods.
The concept of feeding is just to get the hive up to the weight it needs to get through the winter. If it's heavy (like 125 to 150 pounds) I'd leave it alone. If it's light, then I'd feed until you hit your target weight and then stop.
Quote from: Brian D. Bray on October 09, 2008, 08:23:00 PM
Quote from: Cindi on October 06, 2008, 11:42:08 PM
Brian, I must ask this question, you know my curious nature. Do you put the apple cider vinegar in each time you feed s.s., regardless of the time of year. Meaning, is this just a standard that you always have the apple cider vinegar as part of any feeding program? Elaborate please. Have the most wonderful and awesome day, Cindi
If I make syrup I put cider vinegar in it. It changes the acidity to make it more attractive to the bees and an occasional dose as a nosema treatment never hurts. If I am going to take the time to feed I want the bees to take it and the other benefits are a plus.
I thought it odd that Randy Oliver, in his test for Nosema treatments, did not include cider vinegar as one of the methods.
he speaks of it on his web site -SCIENTIFICBEEKEEPING.COM 8-) RDY-B
Other Treatments
I certainly don't want to give the impression that there is anything wrong with fumagillin! However, some folk have concerns that it (or any antibiotic) might inadvertently show up in honey. Others are simply loathe to pay the price for the treatment (although they may pay a higher price in lost colonies after putting their faith in home remedies). In any case, it would be prudent for us to have several treatments at our disposal, in order to customize or rotate treatments, and to avoid resistance to any single drug. As I mentioned in the previous article, hundreds of compounds have been tested to control nosema in honey bees and other insects (most failed).
I have come across several suggestions about adding vinegar (5% acetic acid) to sugar syrup. However, Forsgren and Fries (2003) found in both field and laboratory trials that adding acetic acid to sugar syrup was ineffective at controlling nosema. Their tests with syrup of up to 0.4% acetic acid (by my math that would be equivalent to 1 part vinegar added to 11.5 parts syrup) were meticulous and conclusive. They found that "acidification of the food of honey bees has no influence on Nosema prevalence or development." The strong buffering capacity of the bee midgut may the parasite from effects of acid (Ostermann 2002). The same would likely apply to another home remedy that's been suggested—sodium diacetate. This chemical would dissociate in water into essentially vinegar with a bit of sodium ions, and thus would be unlikely to have an effect upon nosema.
Here's a wild idea: note that any treatment that kills infected bees before they transmit spores would be good for colony health. Rather than thinking of curing infected bees (according to Dr. Meana they are irreversibly injured by infection), instead just kill them off quickly to prevent transmission! Some of the "cures" may do just that—be the kiss of death for the sick bees.
Since plants produce numerous compounds in their sap and bark to resist fungal infection, the botanical kingdom may provide a pharmacopoeia of potential natural nosema treatments. Lodesani (2006) tested several natural compounds, and found both thymol and resveratrol (from red grape skins) to show promise. Others are testing various essential oils. A number of beekeepers swear by feeding HoneyBHealthy® (a solution of emulsified lemongrass and spearmint oils) in syrup, although the manufacturer makes no claims, and as yet has no data to support its efficacy. I am currently testing it. I've also been asked if copper gluconate would be effective—I've passed a request to test this on to those better funded than I.
In Western Europe, two natural products are sold for nosema treatment—ApiHerb (Chemicals Laif) and Vita Feed Gold (Vita Europe)--both have data that demonstrate their efficacy (Unknown 2007).
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>I certainly don't want to give the impression that there is anything wrong with fumagillin!
Mos of the civilized world thinks there is something wrong with fumagillin and have outlawed it...
http://www.bushfarms.com/beesterms.htm#fumidil