Today's new package inspection started with a positive note but did not end so well. I think that I have sucessfuly killed a perfectly good queen during a identification marking. She was placed in the marking tube and secured and themarker dabbed on something to get some paint on the tip and placed on her for marking and the spot looked like it just needed a little more and that is when the paint just dumped all over the place from around the tip. :shock: :'( I put her back in and saw where she went to the bottom of the hive and the bees looked like they picked up on something not quite right with her and they were all over her. I guess the thing to do is go into it tomorrow and see if they killed her :'( and if so go to plan "B". Needless to say that paint marker will not be making the trip with me again.
I've heard some bees will ball a queen even with a little paint on her. All you can do is check tomorrow.
...JP
I actually had a pretty similar experience with a queen last year and was sure she was a goner. Somehow though, she was fine and continued laying through the end of the summer. From the looks of things, she's just about out of eggs now though and there is a supercedure in process. This stuff happens sometimes and the bees will let you know if you messed up or not.
Did you put her back in while the paint was still wet?
If so, her attendants will try to clean it off of her.
By going to the bottom it keeps the foreign substance from contaminating the brood as she is cleaned.
Or possibly the massive amount of paint masked her pheronomes and the hive viewed her as an invading queen.
I believe they were just cleaning her.
Goodluck
http://www.bushfarms.com/beesqueenrearing.htm#Queenmarking (http://www.bushfarms.com/beesqueenrearing.htm#Queenmarking)
"...Gently pin the queen to the top of the marking tube and touch a small dot of paint (start the paint pen on a piece of wood or paper first so there is paint in the tip already) on the middle of the back of her thorax right between her wings. If it doesn't look big enough just leave it. You need to keep her pinned for several more seconds while you blow on the paint to dry it. Don't let her go too soon or the paint will get smeared into the joint between her body sections and it may cripple or kill her. After the paint is dry (20 seconds or so) back the plunger up to halfway so the queen can move. Pull the plunger and aim the open end to the top bars and the queen will usually run right back down into the hive."
Hoping all is well Spark, I get my nucs next weekend, pretty stoked. Is this the same queen you were talking to me about last month? I wonder if my queens will come marked.. oh well they will stay what ever way they come I don't dare. Here is hoping for the best.
CV Bees
Unfortunately things don't always go as planned with beekeeping. That is one of the potential issues with using paint markers. Although I have never dowsed a queen in paint, I do have a couple of lids with dried puddles of paint on them from trying to prime the tip. My experience has been if you put a queen back in the hive with wet paint, the bees will clean her off. Hopefully that is what they did in your case, but I guess it depends on how much paint got on her and where. I switched to the numbering kit a few years ago and have had good luck with it. It is a little bit more money up front, but I believe is cheaper in the long run compared to all the different colored paint pens and the fact they they probably won't be any good after 5 years.
http://betterbee.com/products.asp?dept=629 (http://betterbee.com/products.asp?dept=629)
Hope it works out OK for you.
Hey Rob, how long it take to number a queen. It sets usually on the first go?
...JP
Quote from: WPG on May 02, 2010, 02:28:04 AM
Did you put her back in while the paint was still wet?
If so, her attendants will try to clean it off of her.
By going to the bottom it keeps the foreign substance from contaminating the brood as she is cleaned.
Or possibly the massive amount of paint masked her pheronomes and the hive viewed her as an invading queen.
I believe they were just cleaning her.
Goodluck
With the amount that dumped out all over her I did not hold her very long in the marking tube to let it dry because it looked pointless at that point. She did not act well and they were all over her either trying to clean it off or as you indicated ( viewed her as a invader). My pens have never done this before. I guess that it is one of them lessons that will never be forgotten. If I would have looked at the paint marker as I was holding it vertical watching the first small dot to dry a bit, then you could not have missed the fact that paint was just dripping out the bottom.
Quote from: Robo on May 02, 2010, 09:08:03 AM
Unfortunately things don't always go as planned with beekeeping. That is one of the potential issues with using paint markers. Although I have never dowsed a queen in paint, I do have a couple of lids with dried puddles of paint on them from trying to prime the tip. My experience has been if you put a queen back in the hive with wet paint, the bees will clean her off. Hopefully that is what they did in your case, but I guess it depends on how much paint got on her and where. I switched to the numbering kit a few years ago and have had good luck with it. It is a little bit more money up front, but I believe is cheaper in the long run compared to all the different colored paint pens and the fact they they probably won't be any good after 5 years.
http://betterbee.com/products.asp?dept=629 (http://betterbee.com/products.asp?dept=629)
Hope it works out OK for you.
You hit that one on the head when you said( things don't always go as planned). I have never used the numbering system before and never had problems with the paint method before this, but this one time made me think about the methods for causing potential problems. I was so focused on holding her up against the screen, at the top of the tube that I did not see that the marker was dripping paint as I brought it back over her. Is the numbers you use self adhering or do you have to put a spot of glue on first ?
Quote from: CVBees on May 02, 2010, 08:55:10 AM
Hoping all is well Spark, I get my nucs next weekend, pretty stoked. Is this the same queen you were talking to me about last month? I wonder if my queens will come marked.. oh well they will stay what ever way they come I don't dare. Here is hoping for the best.
CV Bees
No the ones I was talking to you about when you were going to come over to watch, I marked on the following weekend when the weather was better. This one was the last of the queens from new packages that my daughter and I needed to do together.
Quote from: JP on May 02, 2010, 09:30:47 AM
Hey Rob, how long it take to number a queen. It sets usually on the first go?
...JP
It doesn't take long, but does require some planning/setup. I punch out the number disc and leave them number side up on a flat surface. Open the glue abd set cap as a little cup in it that holds enough glue, si I just set the cap upside down on the flat surface as well. Then just get the queen. dip the applicator into the cap reservoir and then put a good dollop of glue on the thorax. Then take the applicator and touch the disc (there is enough glue left on the applicator to pick up the disc) and place it on the dollop of glue and it is done.
Quote from: Sparky on May 02, 2010, 05:41:46 PM
Is the numbers you use self adhering or do you have to put a spot of glue on first ?
It comes with non-toxic fish glue. I'll have to update my video with a numbered disc demo...
Well , just as expected she must have been carried to the bee grave yard, for she was no where to be found. :'( One of the hives in the same yard had several swarm cells on one frame that looked like a prime candidate for a new mother. The part that stinks is that the queen that I wasted was of a different line than the ones that were put in to take it's place.
Sorry to hear about the spill Sparky. If you need a queen or want to swap for a frame of eggs/larvae just let me know, I've been inundated with swarm calls this week (which I've collected :-D ) and could help you out if you need it. BTW, last year I had a paint accident involving a queen, got green all over. Called her the incredible hulk because she looked so bad but turned out to be an egg laying beast.
Quote from: BenC on May 02, 2010, 11:27:34 PM
Sorry to hear about the spill Sparky. If you need a queen or want to swap for a frame of eggs/larvae just let me know, I've been inundated with swarm calls this week (which I've collected :-D ) and could help you out if you need it. BTW, last year I had a paint accident involving a queen, got green all over. Called her the incredible hulk because she looked so bad but turned out to be an egg laying beast.
I appreciate the offer Ben and if things do not work out with the frame that had several swarm cells on it, one very ripe looking, I will contact you to get another queen from you.