Caught another swarm today. As much fun as that is, it gives me a sick feeling knowing it's probably my own bees anyway, leaving a colony in a weakened state. I thought "over supering", leaving lots of room, might prevent this. Any tips on how to prevent swarming?
I did two splits with my two hives, supered, and removed queen cells (when I did the splits)at the end of April. I thought everything was good last week until the county inspector came, and told me one of the hives swarmed. Just a couple days before, I caught a swarm in my yard, then lost it because it was late and I got them into my topbar nuc, which turned out to be too small. They left in the morning before I could put them into my topbar hive. It was most likely the swarm from my own hive. I guess you can only do so much; they are going to swarm if they want to; its just nature's way!
I've been using MB's method of putting in open frames into the brood chamber it seems to work well.
I have to admit I'm not sure I do it right, I have trouble deciding what to do with the frames I pull out to add them in.
http://www.bushfarms.com/beesswarmcontrol.htm (http://www.bushfarms.com/beesswarmcontrol.htm)
I've tried splits but I didn't like that much because it took along time for them to build up again.
I prefer to start a new package in a new hive, its cool to see them ramp up.
Good Luck
Paul
Sometimes we do all the things in getting bees to swarm more...
We:
Reverse boxes in the spring and get the bees to fill the bottom box with brood, and fill the top brood box with early nectar. Why do we do this? Having comb below, diminishes the swarming impulse.
We:
Keep queen around way longer then nature allows. In nature, bees swarm almost every year. They are programmed to do this to perpetuate their species. Beekeepers however can manipulate boxes, comb and expand the area of the hive by supering, all diminishing the swarm impulse to a certain point. But swarming is also supercedure, and having two or three year old queens have been proven to increase the swarming impulse as the bees try to requeen themselves. Having first year queens cuts you swarming rate in half IF you also do the other things that reduce the urge.
The number one trigger to swarming.....Flow! For years, we heard about "not enough room" and a host of other reasons. Studies out of Cornell years ago clearly shown that swarm is triggered by flow regardless of other contributing factors. Ever wonder why bees swarm in September? because they are programmed to take advantage of ideal situations and swarm whenever the flow dictates. Those areas with goldenrod and aster, and even Brazilian peppers in Florida, has a secondary swarm season in the fall, even though those areas with NO flow, see no fall swarming.
You may decrease the urge and rate of swarming. Bees left alone will swarm at a rate of better than 90% of all colonies every year. Beekeeper manipulation may decrease that to 33-40%. But it will still happen.
In today's world of queen and bee shortages, and a beekeepers perhaps desire to be self-sufficient, we should decrease swarming as much as possible. Then use what the bees give us with swarm cells in the other hives to start nucs and increase hives throughout the spring and summer. And move towards getting off the unsustainable package bandwagon that many seem to be on.
Quote from: hollybees on June 05, 2010, 06:37:50 PM
I've tried splits but I didn't like that much because it took along time for them to build up again.
I prefer to start a new package in a new hive, its cool to see them ramp up.
Good Luck
Paul
Not sure what your doing wrong. Removing the old queen and a few frames of bees along with brood when you see swarm cells, impacts the forage bees not one bit! Honey production is NOT diminished at all. All the forage bees remain with the old colony and some studies have shown that removing a queen from laying or the open brood actually INCREASES honey production as far less is consumed by the need to feed larvae.
Removing the old queen and a few frames of brood into a nuc box simulates a swarm, or what is called an artificial swarm. They may backfill the brood chamber until the new queen starts laying but they will also move up the nectar once the queen starts laying. But production, regardless of where they put it does not decrease.
If your talking about splitting your hives 50/50, no wonder you are seeing such an impact and a diminished production.
But removing a queen and a few frames of brood should not impact your hive's production.
And overcoming the initial cost of packages, which you seem to favor from your comment (as compared to the making of your own splits and nucs), may suggest you need to be as productive as possible. ;)
I love it when my hives swarm, as long as I catch them... since I'm not there most of the time to catch them I try to prevent it. Keeping the brood nest open seems to work well for me.
Quote from: BjornBee on June 05, 2010, 08:25:44 PM
Not sure what your doing wrong.
If your talking about splitting your hives 50/50, no wonder you are seeing such an impact and a diminished production.
a 50/50 split..... :shock: well yeah that's what i did judging by your post I see that was my problem.
The Hive's I split were 5 mediums high and booming I didn't think it would be a problem.
I just looked back on it and wished I would have kept them booming.
One of the hives swarmed anyway then was robbed out.
Keep in mind I'm just doing this as a hobby and each experience I encounter is my education along with the your help and others on this forum.
I don't think in terms of max production and efficiency......I have to do that enough at work.
Bees are a great distraction for me, and I do like installing packages.
I installed 3 this spring and I really enjoyed it, I do like to see them ramp up there doing great.
That's just the level I'm at right now, but I'm also listening to you and I see the logic for sure, I'm taking it all in.
So, when you split to deter swarming or start more hives how much is required to "split" to deter swarming and not diminish either hives production.
I obviously did not do enough homework on this one, I assumed split was 50/50. (and yes I know what assume means)
Good stuff, BjornBee
Thanks,
Paul