I was at a bee conference at MSU last month and some guy was claiming his bees wouldn't touch sugar syrup made from Genetically Modified (round up ready) Sugarbeets because the sugar wasn't the same. According to Wikipedia, Sucrose only has a single isomer (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sucrose (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sucrose)), so isn't a sucrose molecule exactly the same no matter what source it comes from? Any thoughts?
I have had no problems feeding my bees sugar I buy at the store and I assume that sugar probably comes from GM sugarbeets.
I'm not able to answer your question regarding the molecular similarities or differences between GM beet sugar and natural, but it's my understanding that most sugar on the supermarket shelves come from sugar cane - and are clearly labeled as such. Only occasionally have I seen sugar from beets. At least that's been my personal experience. It's a disgrace that the food conglomerates have been so successful in their efforts to keep GM foods from being labeled. It's my understanding that the countries in the European Union have made it illegal to import most GM foods and those products that are permitted are required to be clearly labeled.
The top two most GM crops in the country are corn and soybeans. I keep away from pollen substitute made with soy and don't feed HFCS. I solve the GM issue in my own diet by buying organic whenever I can. As far as sugar goes, if I don't see "pure can sugar" on the label, I don't buy it.
I hear ya Stone. My sugar bags are not labeled "pure sugar cane" which means they probably come from beets or at least have some beet sugar in them. According to the American Sugar Alliance, 55% to 60% of US sugar production comes from beets. They grow a LOT of sugar beets here in Michigan.
As for GM sugar beets, it sounds like we'll be seeing a lot more of them: http://westernfarmpress.com/government/roundup-ready-sugar-beets-get-usda-approval-spring-planting (http://westernfarmpress.com/government/roundup-ready-sugar-beets-get-usda-approval-spring-planting)
What a world :(
thomas
T Beek,
Permit me to be a little philosophical: I know what you mean. It can be discouraging sometimes, but I think the world will get along just fine. We just have to look around to see examples of it's wonder and beauty everyday and the goodness of so many people. It's the unregulated corporations and the greed of individuals that is mucking things up. We just gotta work harder to help the world along.
A correction to my previous post: The countries of the EU do not permit ANY GM foods into their countries.
According to the European Commission there are a bunch of GM foods that are legal in the EU including GM sugar beets. http://ec.europa.eu/food/dyna/gm_register/index_en.cfm (http://ec.europa.eu/food/dyna/gm_register/index_en.cfm)
I'm not trying to pick a fight here. I just want to know if my bees will eat GM sugar or rather I have to switch to more pricy "pure cane sugar". To be honest I'm currently neutral on the GM debate. I haven't been swayed strongly one way or another. I respect other peoples positions on the subject.
To Stone's point, from my sparse research, it appears the EU allows GM foods produced in their Union but does not allow imported GM foods. They also require GM labeling. The US seems to contend that the EU is a bit hypocritical and violates WTO agreements. Please correct me if this isn't the case.
I've been reading and writing against GMO (and their corporate profiteers) since the early 90's. The evidence is pretty clear for any/all who care to look. I think there are plenty of good intentioned people (particularly in the US) who know very little about the debate despite the vast amount of available info and data (this forum ain't the place). Most Americans are only too happy to let the loudmouths take charge and make opinions for them instead (I also, am not looking for a fight on this "bee forum.")
This is the time of day I can get squirly ;) I usually try to stay from here for that reason:shock:
As far as the world being fine (especially when humans are gone ;)); Agreed, has anybody else ever read any Vine Deloria for cryin' out loud?
And the answer is .....YES, your bees will consume GMO sugar.
xin loi
thomas
Thanks for your well balanced and honest post Thomas. You are correct a lot of people just haven't done their research yet, including myself.
I've just been feeding my bees the cheapest sugar I could find and never even thought about this issue until the guy at MSU brought it up. He says he only buys "expensive" cane sugar for his bees because his bees were not consuming the low cost (GM) sugar as well. I'm just wondering if people have noticed a real difference in their bees preference for cane sugar vs un-labeled (and likely GM) sugar.
A bunch of beeks are starting to shy away from the sugar that is known not to be cane because of the pesticides that are used that contain neonicotinoids on beets.
Quote from: BlueBee on April 02, 2011, 08:42:20 PM
According to the European Commission there are a bunch of GM foods that are legal in the EU including GM sugar beets. http://ec.europa.eu/food/dyna/gm_register/index_en.cfm (http://ec.europa.eu/food/dyna/gm_register/index_en.cfm)
it appears the EU allows GM foods produced in their Union but does not allow imported GM foods. They also require GM labeling. The US seems to contend that the EU is a bit hypocritical and violates WTO agreements. Please correct me if this isn't the case.
You are right and also generalizing. The EU administration allows GMO but country to countries, you'll find very different approaches and laws (and these also change over time with governments). Some countries will allow GMO research field period; others, limited varieties with a strict list (why some and not others, i am not sure and i think it is hypocritical), others, esp. in the former eastern block are more excited about GMO crops. Labeling if i understand right is mandatory- i think a good thing as it is fair that consumers be informed to make choice in all consciousness.
It is hypocritical to allow 'inside' GMOs and not 'outside' ones (unless there are different varieties.)
When it comes to trade, every side is quick at pointing the other's violations, just a governmental habit.
What when a developing country does not want the food aid because it is GMO as has happened in countries in the southern part of Africa? Is that considered hypocritical? overcritical? or ungrateful (don't bite the hand... Don't look a given horse in the mouth)?
If Corporate profiteers weren't stealing Africa blind AND 'purposely' keeping their citizens divided, do you think they'd be able to feed themselves? THIS IS A TRICK QUESTION.
Africans don't need or want our GMO products (which were really developed and promoted as just another form of control) nearly as much as the 'beast of greed' wants 'their' resources.
thomas
Quote from: BlueBee on April 02, 2011, 09:11:24 PM
I’ve just been feeding my bees the cheapest sugar I could find and never even thought about this issue until the guy at MSU brought it up. He says he only buys “expensive” cane sugar for his bees because his bees were not consuming the low cost (GM) sugar as well. I’m just wondering if people have noticed a real difference in their bees preference for cane sugar vs un-labeled (and likely GM) sugar.
There does seem to be a big hoopla on "cane" vs. "beet", so I tried to look it up a few weeks back. Cane sugar is all sucrose, beet sugar's sucrose % is slightly less, like .05%, or something like that. It's not a huge difference. BUT, where I found the most complaint was from chefs and cooks. The two sugars don't act the same for baking. Flambes (spelling?), creme bulee's (again, spelling), even cookies show a difference.
My experience is that my girls will either take syrup or not, as they choose. I've not noticed a difference between cane or beet, but that's probably because I usually by in a single quantity and have not experimented with offering both. But if it's such a big deal in cooking, then I'm betting the girls can tell the difference, too. As to whether or not it's better or worse for them, I think the verdict is still out.
The bigger concern seems to be the amount of impurities in any given sugar, which if I remember correctly, is why we don't feed things like "natural" sugar and molasses.
BTW, I had a rebate check for Sam's Club so used it to stock up on sugar (C&H). Big OUCH! $15.38 for 25# bag. Even my kids almost had heart attacks over that! Glad I didn't actually have to fork out
real money for that! Keeps me motivated to haunt other locations.
Quote from: T Beek on April 03, 2011, 08:44:18 AM
If Corporate profiteers weren't stealing Africa blind AND 'purposely' keeping their citizens divided, do you think they'd be able to feed themselves? THIS IS A TRICK QUESTION.
Africans don't need or want our GMO products (which were really developed and promoted as just another form of control) nearly as much as the 'beast of greed' wants 'their' resources.
thomas
You sell your honey at the local farmers market. i come next to your stand and i start distributing honey for free, and i do that repeatedly weeks after weeks. If you make your living off beekeeping, you gonna close your stand in short order (by the way wherever you'll go to try selling your honey, i'll be there with my free ware) and fold your business.
That's exactly what happens with food aid: dis-abling growers to grow hence increasing our northern perception that they cant take care of themselves, need more aid and started is the vicious cycle of food aid.
Many countries in Africa would be able to feed themselves if we did not start food aid, and if we stopped the looting of cash crops.
i lived and worked 2 yrs in C.A.R. and witnessed first hand our neocolonialist attitude (there the French, here the Brits, somewhere else the US...), transnational corporations, international administrations and their megalo projects, and us consumers behind all that.. greed is in many places.
Most Food Aid programs are designed to benefit Big Ag.
thomas