Just picked up 6o plastic frames from Mann Lake.
They are pre-waxed if you will but very little. Should I think about adding more wax or just go with what's on them from the factory?
If so do you just melt some beeswax and brush it on? How thick do you coat them?
I assume these Mann Lake frames are the all plastic PF series?
My bees didn't want to build on the PF frames until I rolled on more wax.
I'm sure you'll find a wide range of opinions about rather it is necessary or not. As with everything bee keeping, it varies. Hence you're not going to get a definitive answer on rather or not you need to add wax. On the other hand, it never hurts to roll on extra wax to get them going. The only negative about rolling on some more wax is the time and $$ to buy the wax. However buying a few pounds of wax for getting off to a good start is a small amount of $$ compared to what you've already got invested. I would wax them if it were me.
I use the PF Mann Lake frames and have never had a problem after spraying a little sugar syrup on them to get their attention. I've never had to wax them.
If you put bees directly on the plastic frames they should draw them out just fine. what choice do they have. When you put on the second box is when you will find out if they like it or not.
Yes you can rewax them if you want and add sugar spray too. That will help. Before you do that read up on using purchased beeswax in your hives. There are disease & chemical issues to consider when introducing foreign wax from unknown sources.
The only thing I didnt like about the pf frames was the grooves in the end bars. They make perfect places for shb's to hang out. May not be that much of a problem in NY though. Ive never waxed them, but after having some in hives that werent drawn out, I will have to next year. The bees have scavenged the wax coating and used it elsewhere.
I started on the Mann Lake ones and they took to them fine. I bought 3 nuk's that had already been on 100% plastic so they were already use to drawing out with it.
Quote from: VolunteerK9 on November 08, 2011, 12:31:31 PM
The only thing I didnt like about the pf frames was the grooves in the end bars. They make perfect places for shb's to hang out.
Several beekeepers I know stuff the ends with wax and they say that helps but it sounds like a lot of work to me.
My mentor gave me about 100 of those when I first got started. Now I know why. My bees did not care for them and they were flimsy when hot and loaded. I am in the process of giving them to someone else.
Steve
Me personally i like the plastic foundation with wooden frames they are easier to manipulate and also dont have those cracks for the mites and beetles to hide in and yes i have coated my frames with extra wax. I melt down my cappings and brush it on. Chris
Well they're gonna like them the way they are and they're going to get used to it LOL
Quote from: BoxerDad on November 08, 2011, 11:02:03 PM
Well they're gonna like them the way they are and they're going to get used to it LOL
If you put them in under a strong flow without giving them any other choice, they will be just fine. I didnt have any problems on a Spring flow, but couldnt get the bees to touch them any other time. Im going to rewax the ones that didnt get drawn and use them next year.
Quote from: VolunteerK9 on November 09, 2011, 09:40:25 AM
If you put them in under a strong flow without giving them any other choice, they will be just fine.
I think this is right. The bees will draw out the PF frames if they have no choice. Once you add foundationless frames, they stop drawing the plastic. You want to use plastic only until the frames are drawn.
The Mann Lake plastic frames are stamped 4.9 mm aren't they? My bees drew out four hundred and some because that is what I put them on. Some colonies did better than other in following the pattern given them. Some colonies were pretty insistent on just building what they wanted on the frames. I had to scrape a lot of it and make them try again until they got more in line. I bought unwaxed which you can request (cheaper that way) and used a 4" paint roller to put my clean chemical free wax on them. I think the fresh smelling coating makes a world of difference in acceptance.
Quote from: Vance G on November 09, 2011, 08:05:03 PM
The Mann Lake plastic frames are stamped 4.9 mm aren't they?
I dont think all of them are. Seems like the PF100 and PF120 were the only ones stamped in 4.9. I may be wrong though.
I have used many of Mann Lake's Rite-Cell® Foundation with no problems. I also spray them with 1:1 sugar water to encurage them to start building.
A friend re-waxed his and they were rejected by the bees. Upon inspection we discovered he had filled many of the cells with the wax. We cleaned and re-waxed them, this time holding the frames cell-side down and brushed the wax on from below. This left almost no cells filled and the bees worked the frames as if they were old comb. -Mike
I tried spraying my plastic PFs with sugar water and it didn't' do diddly squat. Results may vary.
If you ever do end up waxing, I would recommend you roll the wax on with a 4" foam roller as VanceG stated. That prevents getting too much wax on the frames, and is much quicker and easier than using a brush. It's really pretty simple to do and it makes the frames smell oh so wonderful.
I use a wide FOAM brush. I think as long as you use foam you will be OK. The hot wax will go on like a ribbon and not splatter.
Rather than rolling or brushing on melted wax, can't you simply rub it with a piece of beeswax? I've got several 'cakes' of wax from rendering out old comb and hive scrapings and have just rubbed it over the PFs. -james
Sure!
I would try both and keep with the easier one. Rubbing wax onto plastic foundation sounds like it will cause a flaky mess though.
I don't wax them. I don't have issues with them drawing them. They have a little wax and that seems to be enough.
As Michael said, it's enough. More is better, but the amount of time and wax isn't worth it. A buddy ordered non-waxed pf's, and painted the wax on. I think he went through at least 10 lbs of wax for 50 frames. And then swore never to buy non-waxed frames again.
-rick
I don't wax my Piecro black plastic foundation (5.3mm cells) because my bees DO comb them up with no problems. However my bees wouldn't touch my pf frames (4.9mm cells) until I put more wax on them. Your results will vary as with everything in bee keeping. I go through about 0.8 pounds of wax per 10 deep frames when I wax with a foam roller.