We'd be lucky to make 10kg/hive/year here. We have 14 hives at the moment, but I can't imagine exceeding 600kg per year and having to pay a honey levy.
Most aussies will have received the voting info about whether to increase the levy and also the level of honey production at which the levy is payable. I'm interested to hear opinions although I don't think I should vote as I don't pay the levy.
Doubling the levy will obviously affect the professionals who make a living out of the stuff rather than us backyarders. Will it mean the packers will lower their already scanty price? Will local honey go up on the shelves and encourage more importation of cheap honey? Will beekeepers lose money and find it hard to keep the operation going? It's only a few cents...maybe the impact will be minimal?
I had actually not heard about this levy before. Could anyone who pays it please describe what records they keep and how it is paid?
Lone
34kg since Christmas - no paperwork to prove it :roll:
Levy the imports !!!!!
I am new to beekeeping, inheriting from dad about 12 months ago (with very little experience, but nothing like on-the-job training). I only have 2 hives active at the moment and hope to increase that to 4 or 5 next spring.
I have robbed 3 times in the last 12 months and each time I get about 35kg per hive. Each hive has 2 supers on it and appear to be really active. I always leave about 4-6 frames of incomplete or uncapped honey each time.
SHB is giving me some stress, but I have modified the bottom boards to be a home made screened external trap (filled with Lime at the moment) and that seems to be helping.
I have been reading the forum for a couple of months now, and thought I should become more than a passive reader :laugh:
Welcome, Suncat. I live in a pretty dry area, so it has the benefit of fewer SHB problems but also less honey. I don't go following flows, though.
QuoteLevy the imports !!!!!
There's no reason on Earth that we should have to import honey at any time. Surely we should be self-sufficient. In a bad year there might be less on the shelf, but I've never known a lack of honey to kill anyone. In a year of excess then save some for the poor years instead of exporting it all out. Then some of the biosecurity issues the levy is meant to deal with will be solved :)
Lone
My understanding on imported honey is when a certain large commercial processor/packer who's name starts with a "C" offered a ridiculously low price for bulk honey from the apiaries they were told to go jump (sort of) the company then built processing plants in Argentina and China and sends the honey back to Australia to be packaged as local product " from local and imported honey"
I spoke to a commercial guy a couple of years ago and he gets 200 kg per hive per year, he moves his hives, follows honey flows etc, plus he gets paid for pollination. I just leave them in the paddock and don't get a lot.
Back to the levy, is this a state or federal levy, I haven't received anything, I know NSW fees are going up and no compensation for AFB anymore.
It is national.
http://www.daff.gov.au/__data/assets/pdf_file/0004/183379/information-honey-levy.pdf (http://www.daff.gov.au/__data/assets/pdf_file/0004/183379/information-honey-levy.pdf)
The proposal is to double the levy to 4.6c/kg and make it payable at 1500kg instead of 600kg
http://honeybee.org.au/programs/honey-levy-reform-and-increase/ (http://honeybee.org.au/programs/honey-levy-reform-and-increase/)
I am guessing that the voting information was only sent to those who recorded more than 11 hives on the last DPI return and voting only available to the same.
The Australian Honey Bee Industry Council is not exactly part of DPI/DAFF, but I find it odd that we did not receive information on the levy when we first registered.
Lone
What is evident is that if you sell all your production to the public yourself you don't pay the levy until you reach 600/1500kg in the year. However if you sell any of your honey, regardless of the quantity, to a processor (primary purchaser ) you will be paying the level indirectly as it will be allowed for in the price you will be paid as the processor pays the level on all the honey they buy.
It is the number of hives you have registered that will flag you for attention with regard to levy payment. I understand the DPI says the average production per hive is 75kg - this is an average based on number of hives registered and honey produced. It is lower than actual as the figure is skewed by the large commercial apiaries for a number of reasons. - they may not have all their hives deployed all year round, they may be pollinating crops and not getting any production of honey, they may loose large number of hives to poison spraying in the area just to mention a few.
QuoteI understand the DPI says the average production per hive is 75kg
The Honey Bee Industry Council says 54kg/hive. Government departments can work in the same building and disagree. I don't know what data they use to work out the average.
I extract from all my hives but based on those figures I would have to extract all 10 frames twice a year, and it's not happened yet that there have been two flows in a year good enough to have all the honey capped. 54 and 75 seem like high figures to me but they might be a small amount to some people. I think paying the levy must be based on honesty for the market/roadside stall sellers.
Lone
Lone I just pulled another 12kg making 57kg in three months from one hive and this is on half frames. What is the vegetation in your area? do you know what is flowing when? How many supers are you running? The core message of the course I did was maximising your honey production by maximising your bees. One hive of 60000 bees will produce more honey than 2 hives of 30000. Run 3 supers only - bottom brood, top two for honey - under super by moving honey frames to the top box and putting empty frames in the middle box - bees wont climb over full frames to deposit honey higher up in the top box move full uncapped frames to the outside. The bonus is that with the bee activity in the top of the hive the SHB has nowhere to go and is hounded out. keep pulling out full frames from the top moving partial frames up from the middle and put stickies back in the middle. That keeps the bees busy and stimulates the queen to keep laying. More workers more honey. Move honey and pollen out of the brood box and up to the honey supers, give the queen room by moving capped brood to the outside and putting empty brood frames in the middle for the queen to fill with eggs. a frame can hold 3000 brood each maximise the number of bees and you maximise your honey.
But then I'm only a newbee
Thanks for the reply, wombat. Most people around here run one deep honey super except the year there was a massive bloodwood flow. Before the days of pests and disease the old-timers would often have double honey supers and leave them alone till they were filled, leaving brood comb for years till it was black. But as my mentor says, one super is a lot easier to work. I usually put the frames I want finished first into the middle area, and turn them around if one side is capped and the other untouched. I move brood frames up for various reasons occasionally, but not just to increase the amount of brood. I am finding the good brood hives are also not always the good honey hives. I try to aim for moderately strong. Especially this year, the hives are just booming and swarming. It is hard to get a honey/brood balance. Strong brood hives and a load of honey goes to rearing them.
When we did have the doubles on the good flow, it took months for the honey to be capped. I tried both configurations, full on top or in middle, but I've seen that bees work either way. Some have said they work from the bottom and some have said the top! My conclusion is patience is more necessary than equipment.
I look all the time for what is out in the paddock. In the past 3-4 years there has not been a time when nothing was flowering. But before that, I couldn't have more than a couple of hives at home and I was also feeding for a while because they were so weak with nothing in flower. It was before the rules changed and I could keep hives in town. It is a bit harder to tell if there are flows in town, but the other beekeepers usually tell me if they are extracting, and hives will never starve there.
I am pretty cautious about percentage of capped honey on the frame. I know that in some areas you can basically extract when uncapped, but they say here 90% + is best. I saw a beekeeper in USA extract and questioned it when most of the frames were uncapped. He called it off after testing with a refractometer. That is more accurate than the dripping nectar test. I don't like fermented honey!
I guess I could make more honey if we had the time to chase flowers. But that would make it a full time job and there is a grazing property to look after here as well as my real work. Lifting hives is too heavy for us to do all the time, and we can't drive hundreds of kilometers and monitor the hives as well. I think you are probably in a more suitable honey area. We have also run out of equipment. It's so hard..! :(
Going back to the levy, I haven't read all the documents, but it does seem to say it's payable for honey production at 600kg.. I wonder if you pay it do you have to include the honey given away? We probably give away nearly as much as is sold.
I am still a learner, every time I see them.
Lone
"I haven't read all the documents, but it does seem to say it's payable for honey production at 600kg.. I wonder if you pay it do you have to include the honey given away?"
Lone, it is on honey sales not on production:
"Australian honey producer levies are set at 2.3c/kg for annual honey sales greater than 600kg."
Kevin
Thanks Kevin!
It wasn't very clear in the DPI document. "Levy is payable on honey produced in Australia, and on honey produced in Australia and used in the production of other goods."
Do you pay the levy or have information about it?
Lone
Quote from: Lone on March 24, 2014, 10:33:58 AM
Thanks Kevin!
It wasn't very clear in the DPI document. "Levy is payable on honey produced in Australia, and on honey produced in Australia and used in the production of other goods."
Do you pay the levy or have information about it?
Lone
No I currently do not produce enough honey to pay the levy.
The reason they are seeking to increase the amount to 1500kg is due to the costs incurred in collecting the levy which currently on 600kg it costs them more to collect it then what they receive.
Kevin
I've been told when you register more than 30 hives they will come looking for the levy
As per there FAQ:
"The simple reality is that research funded with the honey levy and managed by RIRDC has not been able to identify a cost effective or legal mechanism for collecting levy from very small producers including amateurs."
"Stage 2 of the proposed National Bee Biosecurity Program will focus on raising additional funds from hobby beekeepers, where the benefit from this separate source of funds will be spent directly on hobby beekeepers."
We had a bloody ripper of a year this year!! We harvested a smidge over 20kg per hive (2 hives) BUT; We also made 23 splits (now full 2 box hives), drew out over 360 frames and managed to get 1/2 - 2/3 full supers (8 frame deeps) over each hive for winter before we started feeding this month (top up/insurance policy) :-D :-D :-D Cannot wait to see what next season brings!
23 splits, CJ??
Kanga, I guess there is no such thing as free honey. I wonder how they propose to spend it ON hobby beekeepers. Perhaps to raise more revenue from them? I suppose the first thing will be to help fund our premier's 70 grand pay rise?
Lone
I emailed the honey council to hear things straight from the bee's mouth, so to speak.
My email:
Firstly, the voting instruction form sent with the registration renewal was the first I'd heard of the honey levy. Maybe this information can be made available to newly registered beekeepers within the DPI pack. (Although I am a long way off making 600kg/year)
Secondly, how is it proposed that funds be raised from hobbyists, and how will they be spent on hobbyists?
Most importantly, are honey imports charged a levy? Surely imports are one of the greatest threats to the honey industry? It is hard to imagine we cannot be self-sufficient here.
Reply:
Currently unless you are selling 600kgs of honey a year you do not have to pay the levy. Most beekeepers supply a honey packer who pays on the beekeepers behalf.
The best way to receive information is to be a member of a beekeeping club. Is there one near you that you can attend?
Have noted your comments about having information sent to beekeepers in the registration pack.
Most hobbyists do not currently pay the levy as they are well under the threshold. Funds raised will go towards a Biosecurity Plan and employing a Biosecurity Officer in each State. This will benefit all beekeepers. The current levies provide research which benefits all beekeepers. So even thought the hobbyist beekeeper is not paying the current levy they are benefitting from any research that is carried out.
Unfortunately we cannot levy imported honey. We have asked Government about this and it currently cannot be done.
Quote from: Lone on March 31, 2014, 08:46:56 AM
23 splits, CJ??
Lone
Yeah Lone, we made 23 nucs this year. The last round was probably pushing a little hard (lesson learned) - didn't want to feed as much as we have but all good, and we have since consolidated 4 of the nucs back into other hives; so we've ended up at 21 for the year.
CJ
Quote from: Lone on March 31, 2014, 08:46:56 AM
23 splits, CJ??
Kanga, I guess there is no such thing as free honey. I wonder how they propose to spend it ON hobby beekeepers. Perhaps to raise more revenue from them? I suppose the first thing will be to help fund our premier's 70 grand pay rise?
Lone
if there is ever a time to chose to allow more regulation or less regulation, trust me, and others in the states here, choose less regulation. does matter if it is against you or others, or you even think you may want it. Do not allow it, and stop it if you can, or it will just be another brick in the wall my friends.
This is what stinks :-x, At the moment the government is about to either sell or lease our ports to private company's, once this happens the whole " bio security thing" will go down the drain, what private company will give a dam about
" bio security" of the port? Willthey let government inspector's do their job, as they continue to do so now?
Also when varroa mite lands here will the honey bee council take responsibility for the extra cost of dealing with it?
Will the honey bee council discount varroa treatment so the industry will still be viable?
Did anyone take responsibility when Hive beetle landed here? NO! we as beekeepers have had to wear the cost and effort to try and control the beetle.
So they want to take peoples money to further Reasearch and development..... hmmm.. Until they guarantee people that they will actually get something in return, not just a bunch or big words and all that crap, well all I can say we are still fighting the beetle, and soon varroa.. And they say that they asked
the government to levy imported honey and it cannot be done... well that tops it off for me on the "Load of crap list"
If they want people to give there hard earned money, well maybe if the honey bee council actually showed a bit of "clout " when it comes to looking after the industry and the people who keeps it running, then maybe people would not be upset. I gather if honey prices were better then no one would complain as much.. just makes the industry more viable in the long term... Some input from other Aussies on the issues and my comments would be grateful..
Quote from: chriso38 on June 11, 2014, 05:23:12 AM
This is what stinks :-x, At the moment the government is about to either sell or lease our ports to private company's, once this happens the whole " bio security thing" will go down the drain, what private company will give a dam about
" bio security" of the port? Willthey let government inspector's do their job, as they continue to do so now?
Also when varroa mite lands here will the honey bee council take responsibility for the extra cost of dealing with it?
I would've thought that part of any such lease or sale agreements would include agreements about continuation
of bio-security efforts. I could be wrong, but in my view that would be logical.
Quote
Will the honey bee council discount varroa treatment so the industry will still be viable?
Did anyone take responsibility when Hive beetle landed here? NO! we as beekeepers have had to wear the cost and effort to try and control the beetle.
So they want to take peoples money to further Reasearch and development..... hmmm.. Until they guarantee people that they will actually get something in return, not just a bunch or big words and all that crap, well all I can say we are still fighting the beetle, and soon varroa..
I've been meaning to ask about this for a while. I'd be interested to hear about the varroa issue from commercial operators.
In the US there are more commercial hives then there have ever been, despite CCD, varroa, SHB etc.
It does usually mean more work for the bee keeper, but they seem to manage. Apparently, pretty much all of their
feral honey bee hives have been wiped out though.
IIRC in Australia about 30% of pollination happens from feral honey bees and other insects (my memory is a bit hazy on this one, but it is a significant
chunk regardless). I've heard reports that pollination services are on the increase already here in Australia. So, when we do get varroa,
won't the biggest beneficiary be the commercial operators? The feral honey bees will be wiped out, and our commercial operators will adapt.
I'm guessing the demand for pollinators will grow even further as a result.
I guess a big loser might be our live bee export market, as we would no longer be varroa free.
Quote
And they say that they asked
the government to levy imported honey and it cannot be done... well that tops it off for me on the "Load of crap list"
Levying imports can be a pretty big deal. You can be reported to the WTO, and/or have retaliatory levies put on your
exports. Countries with plenty of clout and massive pressure from large lobbying groups domestically take a calculated
decision that putting on levies is worth it (e.g. USA, etc).
The AHBIC is nowhere near a large enough lobbying group, nor is Australia a big enough player to swing its weight around
Quote
If they want people to give there hard earned money, well maybe if the honey bee council actually showed a bit of "clout " when it comes to looking after the industry and the people who keeps it running, then maybe people would not be upset. I gather if honey prices were better then no one would complain as much.. just makes the industry more viable in the long term... Some input from other Aussies on the issues and my comments would be grateful..
Quote from: Better.to.Bee.than.not on June 10, 2014, 10:21:25 PM
if there is ever a time to chose to allow more regulation or less regulation, trust me, and others in the states here, choose less regulation. does matter if it is against you or others, or you even think you may want it. Do not allow it, and stop it if you can, or it will just be another brick in the wall my friends.
I can't speak to regulation in general, or what kind of walls it produces, but recently regulation seemed to finally get its boots
on and do something useful.
Something that the AHBIC seems to have been chasing down for a while(?) are the merchants of cheaply imported 'stuff' that
has been marketed as honey and as Australian (albeit not explicitly, as that would be a little too brazen for even them).
A month ago the sellers of 'Victoria Honey' were fined $30k. The product is neither from our southern state of Victoria,
nor is it actually honey. It is imported from Turkey and most likely some kind of corn syrup. The ACCC have apparently put companies
engaging in similarly mischievous conduct on notice.
So hopefully there will be a reduction in that kind of carry on in our domestic honey market. Most likely without the AHBIC and most
certainly without that kind of regulation in place, the merchants who seek to confuse their customers and misrepresent their
product would be even more ubiquitous than they already are.
Here, in SA, our levies are included in our annual apiary registration, and if you have 20 or more hives, you must send a sample for analysis,which is included in the registration price. Our Bee-Qual training was highly susidised. Given the bio-security issues for bees in Australia, and the nature of free enterprise, and the user-pays ideology of our State and Commonwealth governments, levies are inevitable.
The Imported Honey subject is a whole other issue for a different post. If only more of the bee-hive registration monies collected were truly used for a much-improved AQIS!
Quote from: kalium on June 26, 2014, 07:44:11 AM
I can't speak to regulation in general, or what kind of walls it produces, but recently regulation seemed to finally get its boots
on and do something useful.
Something that the AHBIC seems to have been chasing down for a while(?) are the merchants of cheaply imported 'stuff' that
has been marketed as honey and as Australian (albeit not explicitly, as that would be a little too brazen for even them).
A month ago the sellers of 'Victoria Honey' were fined $30k. The product is neither from our southern state of Victoria,
nor is it actually honey. It is imported from Turkey and most likely some kind of corn syrup. The ACCC have apparently put companies
engaging in similarly mischievous conduct on notice.
So hopefully there will be a reduction in that kind of carry on in our domestic honey market. Most likely without the AHBIC and most
certainly without that kind of regulation in place, the merchants who seek to confuse their customers and misrepresent their
product would be even more ubiquitous than they already are.
For every one thing they do, there will be numerous things they mess up. But hey, it's your country, support it as you will, just saying once you start removing things from the peoples hands, and allow govt. to come in as middle-men with the ability to fine or charge fees, you will never see the end of it, and it will keep increasing. Truth is this other company that was fined probably doesn't care too much about a lousy $30,000. But best of wishes anyways.
Quote from: Better.to.Bee.than.not on June 10, 2014, 10:21:25 PM
if there is ever a time to chose to allow more regulation or less regulation, trust me, and others in the states here, choose less regulation. does matter if it is against you or others, or you even think you may want it. Do not allow it, and stop it if you can, or it will just be another brick in the wall my friends.
I agree, and look what the government did about the Asian bee incursion in cairns, they pulled the plug leaving it to the beekeepers
to do the work,the more you allow the government to intervene the more they will control every aspect, look at the beesites closed in
our forests closed by a government department, what do they do about pesticides or gmo ?