About two weeks ago, I was going to my truck to go to work at about 7am and I heard a lot of bees. It wasn't as loud as a swarm but I kept hearing them all around me, even though I couldn't see any. I was about 100+ feet from my nearest hive, so I started walking down that way. When I get to the first hive, it looks like there might be robbing going on, there is a cloud of bees around the entrance and I see at least 100 around the sides of the hive, going upwards in waves trying to get under the telescoping top. I go a little farther and my oldest hive (about 3 years old) has a little bit of bees on the porch but none swarming around it, and I have had the top propped open with a stick to help cool them off and they all have screened inner tops. I go over to my newest hive, a nuc I installed about a month ago, and there is a lot of bees crunched in the entrance but only a few flying around the sides and looking like they are trying to get in through the top.
I saw this same thing this morning...I come home today and there is the same thing going on this afternoon. I am suspecting that the older hive is trying to rob the other two, since I don't see any bees around the top. The hive I keep seeing the most, suspected robbing going on, is a pretty strong hive too, maybe two years old. What can I do to stop this? Last time I checked about two weeks ago, both big hives had a super of honey, but it wasn't capped, so I was waiting for it to be capped.
If I take the supers off these two big hives, if they are capped, will that stop the robbing?
I don't know that removing a super will stop robbing, probably entice it with the fresh smell of honey in the air. Look at the entrances and the ground in front of the hives for little pieces of chewed wax. That's a sure sign. I have robber screens on my hives with the entrance reduced. That helps with ventilation and protection. I only had two out of 25-30 that got robbed out. They both were splits that didn't make a queen. I had nucs with much smaller population but were queen right.
Just went down there to do a little work in the garden and they are still at it...then not a good sign...trails of ants going up the sides of the hives where there haven't been any...I am suspicious of hive beetles and the bad thing I am supposed to work tomorrow 8am-5pm. Thinking about calling in for half a day and open them up and see what's going on before it gets worse! I would hate to lose them, very good bees...
Are you feeding them? If it's an entrance feeder they are know to create robbing.
Are you seeing fighting on the doorstep? If so, you might think about not opening them, but covering them with a wet sheet, and later, putting on a robbing screen and waiting for things to settle down. From my experience, I really couldn't tell what was what when I opened the hive in a similar situation. If you do open them, just be prepared for some mayhem when you open the hives, mostly so that you don't freak out! Once the hive is open, it's free entry for any robbing bees, and it can look pretty wild. Try to cover the exposed tops of boxes as you go.
No, not feeding them they have a super of honey on them, but last time I looked about 2 weeks ago they hadn't capped it. No, I didn't see any fighting..
Just went and checked the hive, it looks dead!? I don't understand...you can see the comb is chewed and all the honey is gone and the pollen in the comb looks old and not good looking. When I looked in 2 weeks ago, they had an uncapped super full and a lot of honey in the upper deep... I had added a second super and wondered if they might would move some of the honey in the deep into the super, because there wasn't a lot of open space on the deep frames.
There was about a dozen dead bees on the inner screen top....I don't have a clue! :( I took both supers off and just put the hive back together for the time being....
It might be that the comb looks bad because it's chewed up. A lot of variables may have came into play here. I've read where folks say that one of the things that happens during robbing is the robbers seek out and kill the queen. In addition they may have ate the larva for the protein, but I'd imagine you'd see bits and pieces of them as well.
As a matter of fact, I saw something hanging on a thread of mucus or something, that was stuck and dragging on the hind end of a bee walking across the comb... and a little ways away I saw another little piece and the first thing that came to my mind was, "That looks like a piece of a larva"!
There was a lot of bees in there... I wasn't sure if some could have been the original ones that lived in that hive, or they all were robbers. That hive was one of my best.. I caught them as a large swarm that was on the ground about two years ago. :(
It could be full of robbers. Look for queen and eggs, larvae, capped brood. If none of the above, look at pollen cells. Do they look white and chalky cappins? Is there stuff that looks like pepper or dirt in the cells? Do you see any, and I mean even a small section of cells that looks like webbing on it. Wax moths will lay at night while robbers are back home.
Yesterday when I got home from work and looked at the hive, there was just a few bees going in and out of the hive, so I figured today, if they were robbers, I would just go and get the deeps and put them in storage, after freezing them overnight. When I go down there it's the same, just a few bees in and out. I pop the top and hear a lot more bees than I expected, so I put the top back on...I went and put on my hood and got my smoker, and took the top off. There seem to be a lot of bees still in the bottom, but I didn't take anything apart and go to looking....
I am hoping maybe the queen and some bees are still there.
My new small hive, I put a piece of wood in the entrance to make the opening small, since it looked like the robbers were attempting to get to them yesterday. Today no robbers seen, the hive looked calm again... My other big older hive I haven't seen any robbing activity around it, or bees looking like they were coming from the robbed hives to that hive...So I am assuming the robbers are from a wild hive around somewhere...
Well, you have to inspect your frames if you want to know for sure.
I would highly suggest you figure it out. I had a nuc robbed dry in less than 24 hours. You may be seeing robbers coming for the last scraps. I would not trust anything but a robber screen now that I have seen a brutal attack. Still some can even get in this, but they have a better chance at defense. I have had to throw a wet towel over them with the screens. They will destroy a hive in no time. When you see how quickly the numbers build on the screen when you put it on, you will be able to realize how intense an attack really is. Good Luck. G
http://bushfarms.com/beesmisc.htm#robberscreen
Ditto G, If you ever witness a robbing frenzy you won't forget it. Robbing screens are great. They protect and allow ventilation.
I think it is already too late...I thought there were some of the original bees in there...been seeing a few in and out, hearing some buzzing in the hive...but today when I got home from work, we were expecting storms, so I just walked down to take a look, and I didn't see any activity at all...finally two bees came around, one flew right in, the other kept hopscothing around the doorway, figured that one was a robber...but the hive is looking pretty much dead...and I can smell it standing a few feet away.
Hope I can get in it tomorrow and take a better look, and take the deeps and freeze them if I need to, to keep wax moths away.
Sorry, about that.
I would equip yourself with robber screens. I am a firm believer now, i had 4 nucs being assaulted, I built 4 and fought it tooth and nail till I got them on, but now, after 2 days of the robber screens, only a few come around, the hives are again happy, fanning and taking feed. They can ward off and defend the few that try and get thru the notch, a frenzy....well....... that's over quick once they break the ranks. And the results are astonishing. I had always heard, and always watched my hives defend against the few rouges, tussling on the porch, figured whats this big deal........... well, make up 4 nucs in a dearth, introducing queens, and anyone can get the experience, if there is an Italian hive around. I wouldn't wish it on an enemy. Tell you the truth, that package was a comb drawing machine, but they are some ruthless bastards. Pretty sure she wont be rearing brood come next years dearth if she makes the winter. Good Luck. G
I robber screen all my hives. Only takes a minute
Did you still NOT pull the frames and look. A box full of wax moths stink pretty bad. You can save the comb if you catch it early, but sounds like you letting it go too far.
no, didn't get to check it, going to today... thunderstorm came up soon as I got home yesterday.... Do ya'll make robber screens? can you buy them? I need more info on this, never heard of it....
Same thing, we're in a pattern I reckon...I don't get home until 6pm, about 6:15 today...grab a bite to eat and a storm comes up, it's rainin' out there now.... :(
Here's how I make them. They work quite well, easy and cheap.
http://www.beekeepingforums.com/threads/5223-Robber-screen-moving-screen?highlight=robber+screen
Quote from: Beewildered61 on July 22, 2015, 07:52:28 PM
no, didn't get to check it, going to today... thunderstorm came up soon as I got home yesterday.... Do ya'll make robber screens? can you buy them? I need more info on this, never heard of it....
Look at the link I gave you on post 12. simple to make. 8 scraps of wood and some porch screen. G
I like that Idee. I might make a few of those for my established hives. The one I made just has a small entry on the side. I actually left the bottom like yours, so the full entrance to the hive is open for ventilation, but just have a 3/4"-1" notch on the side for them to come and go. Seems to be working great on the nucs
Since this thread is about robbing, I am going to ask a few questions about robbing if that is OK. At my last bee meeting, it was suggested that I put robber screens on my hives (and leave them all year) because the other beeks said robbing by wild bees is a big issue here. So I made some and installed them yesterday. Today I checked on them and took these pics.
> Are the bees piling up on the screen of the Italian hive probably robbers or my bees getting adjusted?
> Do these robber screens look good enough to work? If not, what changes should I make?
> should I leave them on all year?
> I want to move to all top entrances. What suggestions do you have for top entrances combined with robber screens?
Also, one of the beeks I talked to makes a robber screen with more turns (and leaves them on all year) (see pic). Does anyone else do something like this?
> Are the bees piling up on the screen of the Italian hive probably robbers or my bees getting adjusted?
Ask again in 3 days, and the answer will be robbers.
> Do these robber screens look good enough to work? If not, what changes should I make?
YES
> should I leave them on all year?
No reason too, no reason not to.
> I want to move to all top entrances. What suggestions do you have for top entrances combined with robber screens?
WHY?? Bottom entrances work fine. Don't fix what ain't broke
I wish I had a picture of robbers piling up. They were 2" thick covering the whole screen on mine for a day or two. Now they look like your pic. I'm not taking mine off before winter. G
It has rained here so much this season, that I couldn't tell you how many times I've been in them in the rain. I close them up if it gets too bad. I got totally drenched a couple times this year. You gotta do what you gotta do, in my boat, I was queen rearing and splitting a lot. And you can't wait for the weather to be on your side.
Another way to tell if its robbers; stand around in front of the hive. If you start getting hit more than usual then it's robbing,
funny but true.
It was gone...wax moth larva were getting started and some ants, nothing left in the hive :cry: Thanks for the robber screen ideas...
If you have room, bag up those frames in a garbage bag and put them in the freezer. It took a lot for the bees to make them and it would be a waste to just throw them out. After a couple days in the freezer, put them in a strong hive. They will clean them out and use them.
Quote from: rookie2531 on July 26, 2015, 08:04:11 PM
If you have room, bag up those frames in a garbage bag and put them in the freezer. It took a lot for the bees to make them and it would be a waste to just throw them out. After a couple days in the freezer, put them in a strong hive. They will clean them out and use them.
X2. Good Luck. G
Looking at the photos of the robber screens, it appears there was an entrance reducer used and the robber screen over that?
I was looking at my smaller new hive this evening and they seemed too active for it to be 8:30... watching them a few minutes, I saw a lot of bees coming in from the field, and then a couple of times, it seemed a rush of bees coming out of the entrance but not going any where...Then I saw 4 or 5 bees in a group wrestling and they pushed a bee or two off the porch..then I saw another two or three bees wrestling, pushing another bee away from the entrance. But there wasn't any flying around like they were looking for an entrance... I put a reducer on this hive a week ago when I found out what happened to the other, so they only have about an inch and a half or two inch entrance.
Once they overwhelm the guards, its too late. buy one or build one, or reduce to one bee width would be my recommendation. Once one breaks the ranks, they wont give up. G
Agree with Graham, after losing some weak mating nucs this year and seeing the frenzy start. It didn't matter how strong the others were. The robbers were relentless and tried every hive. I had to reduce all hives and stop feeding, put robber screens on all mating nucs, but still lost some.
You should inspect it and make sure your queen is in there and if so, reduce it down to only one bee size. I have heard and read so many people afraid to make it too small, mainly because they don't want to overheat the hive. I would worry more about robbers. They know how to keep from overheating.