I'd previously posted a thread about doing a research project on bees and eventually I had decided on researching washboarding. However there wasn't enough foundation research on it and so I've had to change topic. I want to do something that would be simple to execute as an experiment. I figured something to do with the design of bee boxes would be more technical and clear-cut. I was wondering if there was anything about the current popular bee box design that could be changed or if there was a better way to do it?
I'm still looking for a research question though even if it's not about bee box design so if anyone has any ideas I'd really appreciate it !
"Boxes don't kill bees unless you set them on them."--Aaron Moe
Maddy,
Since there is no information about washing boarding, instead of giving up on it, why not get a good movie camera and start videoing them doing it with real close up lenses and slow it down to see what they are actually doing.
If you do, please put the videos on Beemaster.
Jim
One thing about boxes is the dimensional size of lumber has changed over the years and a 2x10 isn't big enough to make a deep super. You must use a 2x12 and rip it to size. If they made shorter frames then a 2x10 could be used without any waste. I know I'm opening up a whole can of worms with this idea, but it would be a neat discussion.
Quote from: Psparr on September 21, 2016, 01:31:20 PM
One thing about boxes is the dimensional size of lumber has changed over the years and a 2x10 isn't big enough to make a deep super. You must use a 2x12 and rip it to size. If they made shorter frames then a 2x10 could be used without any waste. I know I'm opening up a whole can of worms with this idea, but it would be a neat discussion.
And that's relevant to this thread how? Maybe I'm just dense, but I fail to see the connection. I think you make a valid point, but what is the solution? You might start a new thread and get more responses.
The problem I see is gathering enough data to be relevent.
Any beekeeper here will tell you that if you start 3 hives in the same location, with the same resources, same genetics, the same management....and the same boxes, and by the end of the season they are likely to look different from one another and/or they will need different interventions (harvesting honey, requeening, donate or receive a frame of brood).
....so if you run 6 hives, 2 each of 3 kinds, you will probably see some things that look like trends, but you really won't have enough data to make a determination.
>I figured something to do with the design of bee boxes would be more technical and clear-cut. I was wondering if there was anything about the current popular bee box design that could be changed or if there was a better way to do it?<
I believe it is right on point, but maybe I'm dense.
When I first read the question, I thought about the lumber size issue that Psparr brought up but that is only a matter of convenience for us and not a matter for research. What would be, would be the difference size makes on how the bees develope. I'm sure there has been research done on that in the past.
If you want to look at something different in hives, Google "Paradise Honey" in Finland.
We are at present using 3 of their hives, 10 frame full depth and are about to purchase 50 8 frame full depth to add to our 200 wooden hives.
Our wooden hives are made from 22 x 245 pine and run full depth frames.
Another different hive made in Australia are plastic made by "Nuplas". They have a website.
Psparr, apologies. I see now where you're coming from.
I think trying to change something so ingrained is going to be difficult. Some of use use top bars only, even in Langstroth boxes, so changing the box dimensions wouldn't be that difficult for those people, but most PPL want to have interchangeable parts.
The mass producers of frames, foundation determine box size if you run more than a few hives.
The price of frames is very much a volume thing.
The internal dimensions need to be standard but the material is optional. At present we are predominately using wood but I think the polystyrene Paradise hives have a lot to offer in weight saving and also insulation. The walls are 40mm, or 1 1/2 inches thick so provide good hot and cold insulation.
They weigh under half the weight of our wooden hives.
Quote from: Oldbeavo on September 23, 2016, 09:09:15 AM
The mass producers of frames, foundation determine box size if you run more than a few hives.
The price of frames is very much a volume thing.
The internal dimensions need to be standard but the material is optional. At present we are predominately using wood but I think the polystyrene Paradise hives have a lot to offer in weight saving and also insulation. The walls are 40mm, or 1 1/2 inches thick so provide good hot and cold insulation.
They weigh under half the weight of our wooden hives.
Are they readily available? How does the price compare?
Hi PhilK,
The hives are available in the US here http://www.modernbeekeepingusa.com/polystyrene-hives-and-nucs/polystyrene-hives
Philk
The price is comparable to purchasing ready assembled supers and bottoms and lids with a Qx.
In Australia, Australian Honey bee, Victor Croker in Canberra is the agent, there is a website.
If hive performance is improved then how do you compare the base price?
Quote from: Oldbeavo on September 23, 2016, 09:09:15 AM
They weigh under half the weight of our wooden hives.
I am very weight conscious because of my back. But the weight of empty boxes and combs are nothing compared to when they are filled with honey, just saying.
There are any number of hive designs. I don't think the bees care. They have been making do for forever. We hake hives for our convenience.
I have a bad back. I have decided to go to Slovenian hives to save my back. People choose their hives for their convenience or interests.
I think making hives that suit you are fine but I think there is a line between fun bees and business bees.
I need my bees being as healthy as they can and be gathering maximum honey that is stored for extraction for me to sell. I need to outfit the bees as cheap as possible, frames, foundation, honey extraction equipment, so there is a financial gain from conforming to some extent.
If hive design and material maximise honey production then I am interested and that is why the polystyrene hives from Paradise have gained my interest. They have a large mesh floor, probably 50-60% of the floor area. I think this will help for SHB in reducing humidity in the hive. The insulation factor of Polystyrene has to be beneficial in both hot and cold weather.
As for conserving my back we run 8 frames instead of 10's.