Well the title pretty much says it all for the year. Had plans to split off 2 or 3 nucs from my hives, sell one or two and expand with the rest but it didn't work. Ants got one early nuc and the rest haven't requeened yet. Tried plan Bee which was going with two new queens from a local supplier and had the ants come back wiping out a second nuc with a new queen, you would think I would of learned about the ants from the first nuc. To add insult to injury the second queen didn't take but the SHB's did and trashed the equipment.
Spent two weeks battling SHB's in the yard and have finally got them under control for now, didn't loose any hives to them but held back on making any more nucs till they were gone. No use giving them someplace to move into like a young nuc. Started with three hives and am still at the same number with a nuc that hasn't gone anywhere yet. At least the hives are bringing in some honey, pulled 3 1/2 shallows last week which gave me six gallons. Left another 3-4 shallows on the hives which were full but uncapped so another extraction will be coming down the pike in about two weeks.
Can't say why the year has been so rough so far, splitting out three early nucs didn't help, think I weakened the main hives a little too much early on and they didn't bounce back as quickly as they did last year. Weather is different than last year, it started warm then cooled down and got dry then hot. Finally getting some rain after almost an entire dry month in the upper 80's and lower 90's.
Still planning to set up another nuc or two if possible in the upcoming month, might even try tracking down queens from a supplier but most have sold out already. Hate to spend good money on queens and have them not take.
Guess it's not all bad, one club member lost 12 out of 15 hives and other members have started to feed their hives because of a poor flow. Just had to vent ;)
Hope everybody is having a good year so far.
Every year is a challenge. There are pre-requisites that must be in place before attempting your stated goals.
1) Learn about rearing queens and setup some sideline equipment specifically for that. Grafting tools, mini-nucs, 2F/3F nucs.
2) Before starting queen rearing or nucs you must have at minimum 6 hives from which you are willing to substantially cut down to provide the resources to support the program.
3) Do not ever start nucs or splits without having the necessary laying queen(s) in hand or in pocket or on the table, ready to go.
4) Expect and plan for a minimum of 30% failures. In other words, build or make or rear at least 30% more than what you want. When it all settles out and cancel out the fails you will have what you want.
. If you cannot accomplish 1 and 2, then you must buy queens to accomplish 3.
. If you cannot satisfy 1 2 and 3, then keep the hives together at full strength and be happy with what you have.
. If you cannot stomach 4, then do not even think of trying 1 2 and 3.
Anything less than those pre-requisites leads to severely weakened hives, multiple / high failure of attempts, and overall demoralization of the beekeeper. ( If it was easy, there would not be buyers and sellers )
IMHO
Hope that helps!
PS: The challenge and frustration for me at the moment is unrelenting wind and cool temperatures. Queens are needed next week but they are NOT flying for mating and the ones that have tried are lost. My schedule for splits and nucs is thus delayed at least 10 days. The hives are getting boxes put on right now for added bee-space and curb swarming until we have the mated queens in hand.
Death to all small hive beetles. This freeze spray works. The beetles try to run and hide in the comb cells which the comb cell becomes their tomb. Minus 62F at the tip.
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Blessings
HP, thanks for the plan, it's not my first go round with raising nucs and the cards just haven't fallen right so far this year. If it was easy everybody would be doing it ;). Working off only three hives for nucs and also getting a honey crop has always been a challenge. Loosing the two queens was a setback for expansion but stuff happens. I'm a small timer hobbyist and anything over six hives will get to be too much work with the time I've allocated for the hobby. I"m OK with three hives right now and will try a split later this month just to get the numbers back up, it's just frustrating when you think you have all the ducks in a row.
BEEBOY, this is a very unusual year. So much flooding in Arkansas and Missouri, over 400 roads closed, dikes that are 75 years old are failing. In Florida there is heat and or dry conditions. The Tupelo honey crop in Florida was a bust this year, contrary to Southern Georgia that had a great Tupelo crop. In California my queen rearing friends are dealing with so much rain. Then there is the entire Mississippi delta that mostly has yet to be planted due to flooding. North of St Louis the barge traffic is closed due to swift river currents.
Then there is all the tornadoes, like 600 so far. Thus, a few set backs, I would expect.
So BEEBOY, just a temporary set back is all you are going through. You have lots of time. In February, 2020, to my delight, you will be first to post pics of your successful hives packing in pollen.
All Good Things
Van
Beeboy - your not the only one. I came into spring with 3 healthy hives, and had a plan for a honey crop & splits to 20 hives by fall. ... so far I'm up to 6 hives and 2 of the additions are swarms (from elsewhere). Only 1 successful split so far. 9 failed splits for me. ... this year is definitely different. ... but the years not done yet - so we'll be ok. ... I hope ... :grin:
Quote from: TheHoneyPump on June 03, 2019, 06:15:56 PM
Every year is a challenge. There are pre-requisites that must be in place before attempting your stated goals.
1) Learn about rearing queens and setup some sideline equipment specifically for that. Grafting tools, mini-nucs, 2F/3F nucs.
2) Before starting queen rearing or nucs you must have at minimum 6 hives from which you are willing to substantially cut down to provide the resources to support the program.
3) Do not ever start nucs or splits without having the necessary laying queen(s) in hand or in pocket or on the table, ready to go.
4) Expect and plan for a minimum of 30% failures. In other words, build or make or rear at least 30% more than what you want. When it all settles out and cancel out the fails you will have what you want.
. If you cannot accomplish 1 and 2, then you must buy queens to accomplish 3.
. If you cannot satisfy 1 2 and 3, then keep the hives together at full strength and be happy with what you have.
. If you cannot stomach 4, then do not even think of trying 1 2 and 3.
Anything less than those pre-requisites leads to severely weakened hives, multiple / high failure of attempts, and overall demoralization of the beekeeper. ( If it was easy, there would not be buyers and sellers )
IMHO
Hope that helps!
PS: The challenge and frustration for me at the moment is unrelenting wind and cool temperatures. Queens are needed next week but they are NOT flying for mating and the ones that have tried are lost. My schedule for splits and nucs is thus delayed at least 10 days. The hives are getting boxes put on right now for added bee-space and curb swarming until we have the mated queens in hand.
Mr Claude, I always look forward to you chiming in. Your answers and suggestions are always positive and helpful. Thanks, Phillip
Beeboy are these the ''crazy ants'' that are the talk these days? If I remember right, last year or early this year Alan had a round with them, is that right Alan? How are things with the mites? As I remember last year you had a round with them also. Anyway, do not give up. As Mr Van and others have said, strange year. Wishing you all the best.
Phillip
We have little ants, 2mm long that invade hives, we lost 10 nucs to ants this year.
Even went to putting bricks in trays, nuc on bricks and fill the trays with used engine oil, went away for 10 days thinking this will keep the varmits out.
But no, we had strong winds that blew leaves from the grape vine into the trays and the ants crawled across the leaves, lost 3 out of 12 in that site.
We have made barriers about 2ft out from a hive or nuc with "antsand", pyrethriun based that doesn't seem to hurt the bees. Good so long as the ring is not broken or rained on.
Ben,
I doubt they are Raspberry Crazy Ants. We had them brought here several years ago from Texas in horse equipment. They were only 6 miles from my farm. They seemed in stoppable. They covered his farm for several years. They could not keep them out of his house, they are attracted to electrical currents. If you have a power cord on the ground they follow it to the source. They removed every other type of ant on his farm, even Fire Ants. They reproduced so fast, ant poisons couldn?t stop them. He had rings of poison around his house and they still kept coming in. I talked to my buddy this year and they all died out of some natural cause, thank God.
Jim Altmiller
Ben , the ants are the big nasty red carpenter ants. There are a lot of woods around my property and they invade from there. The only defense that seems to work is sprinkling fire ant bait around the perimeter of the hives maybe 4 or 5 feet out. Haven't seen any "Crazy Ants" yet, if they show up my wife will want to move, she doesn't really like any type of bug except for butterflies.
Looking back on my records I realized that it was windy when I did the early splits and I'm wondering if the queens were blown away from the yard during their mating flights.
Quote from: Ben Framed on June 04, 2019, 01:03:23 AM
Beeboy are these the ''crazy ants'' that are the talk these days? If I remember right, last year or early this year Alan had a round with them, is that right Alan? How are things with the mites? As I remember last year you had a round with them also. Anyway, do not give up. As Mr Van and others have said, strange year. Wishing you all the best.
Phillip
I don't think mine were "Crazy Ants" Phillip. I believe we are dealing with Argentine Ants out here. They finally started invading hives this last weekend. I haven't used the Borax treatment yet - been to busy - but I will soon.
Quote from: CoolBees on June 04, 2019, 03:42:38 PM
Quote from: Ben Framed on June 04, 2019, 01:03:23 AM
Beeboy are these the ''crazy ants'' that are the talk these days? If I remember right, last year or early this year Alan had a round with them, is that right Alan? How are things with the mites? As I remember last year you had a round with them also. Anyway, do not give up. As Mr Van and others have said, strange year. Wishing you all the best.
Phillip
I don't think mine were "Crazy Ants" Phillip. I believe we are dealing with Argentine Ants out here. They finally started invading hives this last weekend. I haven't used the Borax treatment yet - been to busy - but I will soon.
I hope it goes well for you and the ants are controllable. We new beekeepers missed out on the good old glory days of no SHB, Mite, or Ant problems. It Must have been a joy not having to deal with these problems.
Phillip
ANTS?? How do the ants harm the hive? I guess they kill and take the larva. What about adult bees, can they fight the ants?? Do the bees abscond or die out. Is the comb destroyed? Is the queen killed?
Do the ants attack by thousands or hundreds?
I have never had an ant problem so I am asking the details.
All good things,
Van,
One day you have a nice strong hive and a week later there are no bees to speak of. You find dead bees and ants in the bottom and the carpenter ants have moved in and you have ant eggs in the hive.
Jim Altmiller
Van - the little ants we have out here, invade by the millions. Given a chance, they blacken every surface in the hive. They eat the honey, the brood, chew on the bees, etc. I think they are too small for the bees to bite. The bees just seem to give up and huddle. ... different area, different ants I guess.
The little Argentine type ants just invade the hive by the thousands, so many that the bees can't keep up, the come in through vents and the entrance. Any crack that is not closed.
Bees just give up and leave in a swarm, all bees go.
My neighbour caught one from my hive, couldn't prove they were my bees, so he has a new hive.
We also have a larger ant that is found in rural areas, 5-7 mm long, dark red in color, we call them meat ants. Most of the time the bees win the war at the entrance but every so often the ants win.
Part of the problem with meat ants is that the bees most of their time fighting at the entrance rather than collecting honey.
You can follow the meat ants to their nest, up to 100yds from the hives and give them some white ant killer.
Quote from: Beeboy01 on June 03, 2019, 04:57:29 PM
Can't say why the year has been so rough so far, splitting out three early nucs didn't help, think I weakened the main hives a little too much early on and they didn't bounce back as quickly as they did last year. Weather is different than last year, it started warm then cooled down and got dry then hot. Finally getting some rain after almost an entire dry month in the upper 80's and lower 90's.
Still planning to set up another nuc or two if possible in the upcoming month, might even try tracking down queens from a supplier but most have sold out already. Hate to spend good money on queens and have them not take.
Guess it's not all bad, one club member lost 12 out of 15 hives and other members have started to feed their hives because of a poor flow. Just had to vent ;)
Hope everybody is having a good year so far.
This sounds like my last year. Got big-eyed, made splits to early/too small, didn't recover until after the flow was over, harvested a whopping 20 lbs from six total hives. Sorry for your frustration.
I talked myself out of the early splits this year (sometimes out loud), and let them build up some, and got thru the March Cold Snap first (we always have one here). I'm learning that bees build faster when the box is full of bees, and also that it's easier to peel extra bees off a booming hive than it is to try and coax a little nuc to build faster. A full box also has fewer pest problems.
But you got a lot of honey, now you can buy more boxes for next year :)
"But you got a lot of honey, now you can buy more boxes for next year :)" A fool and his money, been there, done that. I'm good with equipment, have enough for another 3 or 4 hives if I put everything in use. Need to work on replacing some frames over the next month.
Van, when the carpenter ants take out a hive the bottom board is about 1/2 deep in dead bees and ants, must of been an epic battle. Rain is predicted for most of the week and the Cabbage Palms are putting out flower stalks so the next flow is just around the corner. Going to try another small split in about a week, still early enough in the season to give it another try.
3 frames of brood with bees with a frame of field bees shaken into a 5 frame nuc makes a good start.
One frame of honey and one empty frame make up the 5.
Most of the time we let them make their own queen.
Quote from: Oldbeavo on June 06, 2019, 07:24:48 AM
3 frames of brood with bees with a frame of field bees shaken into a 5 frame nuc makes a good start.
One frame of honey and one empty frame make up the 5.
Most of the time we let them make their own queen.
IMHO That would bee far too many bees in a 5er. 1 frame of brood makes 2 to 3 frames of walking bees. That 3 frames of brood+ bees+ another shake is going to yield 12-14 frames of bees. A 5 frame box will not hold 14 frames of bees. Sure they will make multiple cells, but likely much of it would abscond or multi-cast mini swarms before there is a laying queen left behind in the box.
A nice 5 framer is 1 full capped brood frame in the centre. Sided by 1 foundation and 1 empty drawn comb. The 2 outer frames 1/2 full of mixed resources (honey/pollen). 2 maybe 3 frames of shook bees to populate it. And topped it off with one ripe queen cell on the empty drawn frame.
OldBeavo and HP. I like both and have made both types of nucs. I only have a single bee yard, HP. The problem I occur is foragers returning to orginal hive and subsequently robbing the nuc.
I understand there are many ways to create a nuc such as splitting and relocating all bees so there is no original hive to return to. Being a hobbyist my biggest problem is limiting the number of hives in my apiary.
Current problem: 15 queens hatching Sunday 6/9 and I have to make queen castles for open breeding 8 queens and instrumentally inseminate[II] 7, at least try to II 7. I have to catch over 100 drones, specific light colored Cordovan drones that have desired genetics. The problem with drones is the little rascals scatter so trapping by use of a queen excluder from a single hive does not work so well. Oliec acid, queen pheromone only works on a DCA in flight.
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Honeypump ,all I can say is "it works" without the problems predicted. They don't swarm. The new nucs are moved from the old hives so as bees don't return.
Most of these nucs are in 8 frame boxes in 6-8 weeks and go on from there.
Our 4 frame nucs are made with 2 frames of brood, this is not only me as a big time BK makes his nucs the same way without problems.
Your logic is fine, but try some as they are successful in OZ.
I'm making 4 frame nucs, why? because my nuc boxes are deeps cut in half and are just a little short of a full 5 frame nuc. Learned it the hard way when I cut a couple deeps in half and couldn't fit 5 frames in the nuc box. LOL measure twice check again and cut once. ;)
I would have left the 4 frame boxes oversize. If you go two and three stories you can spread out the top boxes to get wider honey frames. Just use a spacer in the bottom brood boxes.
Ace, I left the boxes oversized, didn't cut them down. They are just wide enough to fit on a regular 5 frame nuc box but only hold 4 frames which works just fine. The extra space gives enough room to pull an outside frame without rolling any bees.
Beeboy
I saw a nuc video where the experienced beekeeper said he leaves 6-9 inches under his frames in the nuc as new bees like ?roaming? room - just saying
Have you tried protection like pots or coffee containers of cooking oil under the stand legs? They help if you keep the ground beneath them fairly low cut. They are a fair amount of maintainece to keep clean so they work. An oversized lid a few inches above helps.
I'm using 4x4 wood frames sitting on cinder blocks for my hive stands and can't easily convert over to another style that keeps ants out. If I was setting up an ant proof stand I would go with short pieces of PVC tubing mounted in drilled holes with cut up plastic water bottles over the PVC as ant protectors.
Just called the beekeeper whom I'm making the nucs for. Seems he has been out of work for a while and now has a job offer about 80 miles away. He said he won't have time for the bees and wants me to keep the nucs. Hate to see a new bee keeper lose interest after only a year, told him that anytime he wants any honey give me a call which is the least I can do.
Need to move one of the nucs over to a deep this week and re- arrange the yard a little also deal with the laying worker nuc. Guess things are looking a little better, the Cabbage Palms are just starting and should get a good crop off them if all works right.