Any one here have experience in obtaining packaged bees?
We sell 3 to 5 hundred packages a year.
https://beezneedz.com/
Yes Mr. Ben, I have experience. I have never lost a package nor had a package abscond.
I ordered one package for 2020. I enjoy seeing the complete entropy of the bees evolve into complete order as the package bees go about organization and create a functioning hive before my eyes.
Blessings
My second year I bought 2 packages. Neither one lasted more than a month. Waste of time and money unless that is the only choice for you to get bees IMO. Local Nucs are much better.
That is impressive iddee. Y'all are working your rears off for to get that many together! Hats off to you. When do you usually begin putting your packages together? I am guessing commercial keepers buy the most like pollinators?
I bought one package last year at a local store and this year I'm getting one shipped in. Hopefully it will do good things.
I picked up a package and nuc this year. Both on the same day. I think on April 28th. The package did well. I was able to pull some fall honey off the package hive. At one point going into late summer early fall it was stronger than the nuc. She seemed to slow down on laying earlier than the nuc. Where the nuc hive kept getting stronger. My wife pre ordered another for me. It?s supposed to ship March 27th. So right at a month earlier. Keep in mind also those two were my first hives and didn?t have any resources to pull from to help them.
Ben,
I started 2 1/2 years ago with a single package, I did not know that Russians will just keep queen cells all the dang time and freaked when I saw them and split the hive. Both hives made it and made it through the winter. BUT. That split has never produced like the original, even though it really is only a few months behind it time wise. I have always figured it was due to the local genetics mixed in. Last spring the 2nd hive swarmed. I captured it and successfully got it rolling in its own hive. Interestingly it was the easiest hive I have ever started, and I think it has to do with the bees naturally selecting the "crew" for that swarm. who would know better than them who needs to go? I also installed a new package that spring. It is the only one I have had problems with and I think I did it to myself by not waiting long enough to release the queen. Had to re-queen twice and the hive beetles still got that one (only hive I have lost so far). I also split one other hive and supported it with brood from an existing hive. That one did well. I have 4 packages on order for this spring, and with the addition of two hive I bought from an older guy getting out of the business, I will be at ten by spring (if none die).
Packages work very well. I do one thing not mentioned anywhere I know of. The day after I install the package I hit it with oxalic acid, as you have a hive with no brood and therefore nowhere for Varroa to hide. Starts you off with a far lower pest level.
Barry
Barry, good post. Agreed treat when no brood is present, even packages. Sounds like you know what you are doing. You are either experienced or you studied very well.
Van
So u start out with acid ? before u know v count?
Or do you assume bee's are full of v , if so why buy?
If you have apiary , that you treat, do you quarantine packages before you bring in. Do you think 80% of bee loss is disease or man ?
Mikey, the bought packages are already at a minimum of bees, usually three pounds. To test properly these packages with alcohol kills many. The reason to go ahead and treat as BAHBEEs described is a good reason, because IF there are any exposed mites on the bees all mites should be killed with safe to the bees OAV. We know mites are always a threat. BAHBEEs suggestion is legitimate in my opinion because he is doing so before any brood can be started, which capped brood leaves a hiding place for breeding mite eggs and devolopeing mites to hide beneath the same capped brood. It's a good chance that packages are as clean as possible when sold by suppliers, such as iddee, because of state regulations and valued reputations to keep, but to be extra safe, giving your new package the best leg up to the saddle is not a bad idea. I think BAHBEEs in on the right track as long as the queen is not able to leave the hive with the package before brood is started. Now this is just my opinion.
Phillip
What Phillip said...largely,
Note there really is no risk to OAV treatment, and I simply assume that there is a hitchhiker or few in any package. It isn't like the package was raised in some sterile isolated environment...we/they all have some Varroa, it is just a matter of keeping them beat down low enough the bees can deal with them.
ANY time I know I have a broodless hive I hit them with OAV (a captured swarm gets it too). I wouldn't be this way if Varroa was not so widespread, but it is.
Also I treat all my hives in fall/early winter regardless of mite count. Honestly I don't even worry about such counting, not because there is no value in that number but because if I simply react to seeing a simple increase in them on the bottom board and break out the OAV all during the year so I simply don't have Varroa problems that get out of hand. That combined with my fall treatment system seems to work.
All that said, I still feverishly battle wax moths and hive beetles. Now that I have the OAV I actually consider the beetles and moths to be a far worse threat to my hives.
So, in short. Yes, I do perform OAVs without doing mite counts. I think of it as a prophylactic approach.
It is worth stating, Most Beekeepers in my area lost 40-50% of their hive over the last 2 years...I have not. I only do 2 things that are "different". The use of OAV, and I feed as much as I can cram down them all fall. Well, I also just don't screw with them all that much. I add supers and take them, feed them when needed...react if I see something in those actions, but I am not constantly opening up my hives.
Barry
Barry, agreed, very well written. My exact approach to the mite problem is the same. I don?t count the mites for two reasons;
1. I know the mites are present.
2. I will not kill my bees with alcohol or dust with sugar. The poor bees seem so confused as to why they are covered in dust and my bees trust me. I just can?t violate that trust.
Best to the bees
Van
Thanks Van,
Similar feelings...I kill far too many the times I do have to break into a hive...just cannot do things that kill more without some drastic reason!
Barry
Yes, Berry, I discovered years ago when I inadvertently squished a bee, the bees have memory and some sort of feelings for lack of better wording.
I squished a bee on an adjacent hive lid. I watched a calm guard bee gently walk up to check out the squished bee. One sniff of he dead bee and instantly, to my surprise the guard bee quickly determined, correctly I might add, that I was cause of squished bee and the guard bee made a bee line for my protected face. That single guard bee made that high pitched buzz rite in my veil, which alerted the other bees that I was a danger, I killed a sister bee.
As you probably already figured I soon had a face veil full of angry bees. I had to quit my inspection and move on to another hive. However, I was followed by an angry guard bee which also alerted the second hive with that high pitched buzz. Upon removing the lid, the second hive was on alert and proceeded to let me know I was not welcome and I would be stung if I continued with the second inspection.
So I replace the lid on the second hive and walked away for half hour. Upon returning to the hives 30 minutes later, all was normal and inspections proceeded without further complications. The above ordeal all started with a single accidental squished bee and a single guard bee with that unmistakable high pitched angry buzz which I have long since recognize. A very high pitch, constant tone that does not fluctuate in pitch or audio, a constant tone, alarm it is and serves as a call to other bees to defend, be on alert, danger. If you listen to your bees, they talk.
As I walked into my apiary this afternoon, 53F, calm and sunny, several bees approached me to ask if I had any food for them. No less than 8 bees politely asking. Desiring some sugar syrup I imagine but still to cold to feed syrup at the present weather conditions.
Blessings
I bought two packages back in the day. The horse kicked over my first hive and the bees flew off.
My second package were Midnight bees (that ages me, eh?). They were very gentle. Could work them without gloves or veil and they produced good amounts of honey. Gave them to my old track coach when I went off to seminary.
Yes, Father Michael, I have also had acquaintances with the midnight bee as you call them. Indeed, very gentle black bee, just excellent at working such as comb building. The most beautiful white comb I have ever laid eyes on.
I would like to obtain a queen from such stock of gentle black bees. However, I have not been successful at locating a queen and have kept an eye out the past few years.
I do have one very beautiful solid black queen from California, but the progeny is all yellow striped. Since I have but one apiary location I can only breed for Cordovan Italian as all my drones are typical Italian or the more beautiful drones of Cordovan Italian.
Those gentle black bees are around, I just have not the opportunity to come across such a fine black bee for sale. Some day the Blessings will arrive and I will certainly give the fine black queen a new home.
Blessings
Packages are a nice way to build an apiary. Especially if you have old comb.
I recommend packages to anyone who asks at the bee club.
However, you should not go into winter with the package queen, IMO.
I have the most success when I pull the package queen and let the hive make their own queen. A lot of times the hive will do so on their own. I like to pull the queen as soon as they fill out the first medium, if it's a normal queen.
For me in SW OHio/SE Indiana the package queens just don't make it thru winter.
Quote from: jvalentour on December 19, 2019, 07:49:17 PM
Packages are a nice way to build an apiary. Especially if you have old comb.
I recommend packages to anyone who asks at the bee club.
However, you should not go into winter with the package queen, IMO.
I have the most success when I pull the package queen and let the hive make their own queen. A lot of times the hive will do so on their own. I like to pull the queen as soon as they fill out the first medium, if it's a normal queen.
For me in SW OHio/SE Indiana the package queens just don't make it thru winter.
jvalentour, I have heard the same advice given by others as far as adding a new queen in time. Maybe the queens are older? Or, there other reasons that eventual replacement is recommended by some keepers?
Thanks, PHillip