Bee Losers

kipland_r · September 18, 2007, 11:54:06 AM

Hi, my mother and I have been trying to keep bees in Idaho now for about 3 or 4 years. The first year was great, and we extracted alot of honey, but during these last years its all gone down hill.

That first hive that we extracted from- gone. Everything was gone the next year. We thought we did something wrong or the bees got attacked by termites or something, so the next year we bought two more hives and the same story. So this year we decided to buy two hives and put them in a different location. They were working really hard over the summer, we saw them flying in and out all the time, but then this morning when we checked, they were all gone. No honey, no bees, only earwigs.

We honestly are not sure what happened, and I'm wondering if they just swarmed do to ill care, or not providing enough super room, or if its related to all these other incidences of pests attacking the hive. Anyway, my mom is done with bees for the time being and is sick of them just disappering.

If you have any ideas or comments, they would be most appreciated.

Thanks,

Understudy · September 18, 2007, 12:01:17 PM

It's not nearly as easy or as romantic as others make it out sometimes.

When you bought your hives, what did you buy packages or complete hives?

How often did you inspect the hives?

Describe your hives.

It sounds like the bees absonded. Which means they took off in search of a better home.
Did you have any issues other than the termites? Like ants, racoons, mice, etc.

Was there frequent robbing?

Is there enough plant life in the surronding two mile area for them?

Was there a suitable water source nearby?

I am not trying to grill you, just find out what some of the circumstances are so that if you do try again you have a better chance.

Sincerely,
Brendhan

kipland_r · September 18, 2007, 01:26:44 PM

Thank you for replying Brendhan, Yes I know that this is not a romantic endeavor. It is very frustrating. I have a ditch running right by the hives. We are in the middle of an ag area and the bees were right by my garden, where I have flowers etc. I have fruit trees and roses. Plus the fields around us are growing hay, corn etc.
I bought one established hive originally and got alot of honey the first year. They took off that fall or spring. The second year I purchased 2 packages. A beekeeper near by helped me get those bees going but by fall they were gone. This last year I bought 2 more established hives that I purchased from an estate. They were very strong hives and I saw bees working up until about 2 weeks ago, the last time that I mowed near them. I hadn't noticed any termite or ant activity. I don't have racoons and I don't think there were mice there. I would notice because I put these last two hives right by my backyard so that I could see them all the time.
I put a shallow super on each hive back in June because they were such strong hives I didn't want them to run out of room.
That was the last time I pulled the cover off the hives to have a look. I thought that if I saw bees working at the entrance that all was well. Not so.
If you have any ideas where I am making my mistakes I would appreciate it. Thank you

Kathyp · September 18, 2007, 01:34:22 PM

don't know where you are, but a lot of us have had a rough year. we have had to feed at times, in a normal year, we would not. i got 0 honey this year even though the bees have worked hard. i had to feed off and on through the summer. i am feeding now to get them ready for winter.

because my bees were working hard, i would not have realized that they were not putting away honey if i had not gotten into the hive to check. i would not have known until i had no honey supers to pull.

perhaps your bees just left to find better feeding grounds?

Scadsobees · September 18, 2007, 02:12:54 PM

Did they have any symptoms? What do you see in the hive/in the combs? Bees left alive or dead in the hive? Any brood? Decaying brood? Odors? Honey stores/ pollen stores left?

There are lots of culprits, and termites isn't one of them, and unlikely ants in a strong hive. Mice usually won't get into a hive until late fall/winter or if the bees are bad suffering.

There could be a problem with drought and dearth. I don't know what your area is like, but if it is green, then unlikely that they would die/leave from that. Agricultural areas often don't offer nectar flows as good as one might expect.

You could have a problem with pesticides being sprayed locally.

They could have gone queenless and not raised a new one.

Robbing is a possibility, but if they were strong, then it is somewhat unlikely. This would only happen if there are other hives in the area.

They could have gotten any one or more of these diseases/pests and dwindled to nothing
Pests:
#1. Varroa mites
#2. American Foulbrood
#3. Small hive beetle
#4. European foulbrood, nosema, viruses, tracheal mites, etc
#5. Skunks or critters (these will make them noticably mad first, if in your yard I think you'd have noticed)

What you have described is pretty vague and could be caused by almost any of the above or other problesm. Pictures are good :)

Rick

Brian D. Bray · September 19, 2007, 11:28:30 PM

First question that needs to be answered is: How often did you open up and inspect the hive? You should check the hive every couple of weeks--Oncw a month at the absolute minimum. If you just set them up and let them go on their own--we have a term for that--it's a bee haver not a beekeeper.
If you don't inspect your bees then you can never know what the problem could have been. Inspecting a hive lets the beekeeper determine when the bees need another box, what's going on in the hive, and can alert the beekeeper to developing problems so they can be corrected before they bees die off.
Use the Tutorial on this website for starters.
I don't know how Idaho did this year as far as honey crops were concerned but here in Western Washington we had flowers with little of no nectar. More than 1 beekeeper lost their hive to the bees absconding looking for a better forage area.

sean · September 20, 2007, 06:17:39 AM

he did say that the last time he pulled off the cover was in june. Kip;and_r, as brian says you need to inspect more frequently than that. It is hard to really say what went wrong without knowing what indicators there might havve been because in most cases there would have been signs of a problem.

But dont give up. We are all here to help if you are so minded to try again.

BeeHopper · September 20, 2007, 02:49:59 PM

Quote from: kipland_r on September 18, 2007, 11:54:06 AM
Hi, my mother and I have been trying to keep bees in Idaho now for about 3 or 4 years. The first year was great, and we extracted alot of honey, but during these last years its all gone down hill.

That first hive that we extracted from- gone. Everything was gone the next year. We thought we did something wrong or the bees got attacked by termites or something, so the next year we bought two more hives and the same story. So this year we decided to buy two hives and put them in a different location. They were working really hard over the summer, we saw them flying in and out all the time, but then this morning when we checked, they were all gone. No honey, no bees, only earwigs.

We honestly are not sure what happened, and I'm wondering if they just swarmed do to ill care, or not providing enough super room, or if its related to all these other incidences of pests attacking the hive. Anyway, my mom is done with bees for the time being and is sick of them just disappering.

If you have any ideas or comments, they would be most appreciated.

Thanks,

kipland_r ,

It is very unfortunate the circumstances you are in, I cannot offer you advice but encouragement. Please do not give up unless you experience financial hardships in hanging on to this endeavor. Beeks here and abroad can help you overcome what ails you and your bees. It will take baby steps to get you back on track so that you can enjoy beekeeping again. Hang in there :)

BeeHopper ( 2nd year Beek )

randydrivesabus · September 20, 2007, 03:02:15 PM

is there any pesticide use nearby?

Dr/B · September 20, 2007, 04:38:55 PM

Quote from: kipland_r on September 18, 2007, 11:54:06 AM

We honestly are not sure what happened, and I'm wondering if they just swarmed do to ill care, or not providing enough super room, or if its related to all these other incidences of pests attacking the hive. Anyway, my mom is done with bees for the time being and is sick of them just disappering.

If you have any ideas or comments, they would be most appreciated.

As it's been said, a whole host of problems could have affected your bees. There's some good ideas listed above, in this thread.

Do you feel you might have pulled them down too much with the last honey robbing, causing them to fail in winter? I'd check mine once a month during the productive months, just to keep an eye on things. So many different things can happen, some that might need addressing quickly, to make the colony succeed.

I'd try to mentor thru maybe the guy you buy your bees from, or another local beekeeper. Local beekeepers can show you tons of stuff that's not in the books, that'll help you tremendously in the long run. Now the subject of chemically treating bees is VERY controversial, but if I had lost bees like you, I'd treat them (per usual recommendations) until I could determine EXACTLY what was killing them off and/or causing them to abscond. Maybe your local county extension agent could help you with your specific area. It's kinda odd, when the bees left, they took their honey with them.

Hang in there. My first year I lost all of my bees. My mistake was not feeding enough. You learn alot as you go.

Dr/B :)