another lesson learned (foundationless frames)

[Understudy]

I have been doing some experimenting. I wanted to do some more cut comb honey and see what is was like to deal with foundationless frames.
have eat
#1. The come isn't as well reinforced. I have a tendancy to do shake out of my bees. I will usually tap it against an empty hive body to get the bees to come out. Well I must have tapped a little to hard. I had three pieces of comb break in the frames. That was very discouraging.
#2 If I take out each frame to remove the bees it can be a time consuming process. Also my bees hate the bee brush. They develop bad attitude if I use it. Also if I remove the frame the burr comb can break and spill honey which causes bees from everywhere to line up at the buffet.

What needed was a method to remove bees from frames in a chemical free, brush free method.

Well I have one. It isn't completly brush free but it is a whole heck of a lot better.

I was moving my shop vac and I had a little light go on over my head. Why not connect the blower side and blow the bees off the frames. So I went and gave it a shot. Bees went flying  because of the shop vac this was great. There were still a few bees on the frames. Stubborn ones. I could brush those off just before I brought the boxes in the house so if the burr comb did break it was only outside for a small bit of time.

I tried another idea that did not quite succed. I have a medium with a hole in the side for the shop vac nozzle I used it for an experiment that had moderate succes but there it was sitting empty. I put the medium on the ground and place the honey super on top of it. Connected the hose to the hole in the bottom box. Turned the vac on. There wasn't enough air coming out of the vacumm with enough pressure to blow the bees off the frames that way. So a bigger blower motor is going to be needed. I feel like Tim Allen. rouh rouh rouh.

Sincerely,
Brendhan

[Jerrymac]

Somebody awhile back mentioned air compressor and blower.

How about pulling the super just before dusk and the bees abandoning it before it gets dark.... I might be trying that this weekend. ( I tried it once but I think it was too early in the day.....Thay wouldn't leave.)

[Scadsobees]

Yeah, the same light came on for me earlier this year.  I use bee-quick which isn't quite so quick and usually leaves a few bees in the hive, but gets most of the job done but disturbs them less.  After I bring the supers to the garage, the few left usually vacate to the window. The first few supers to the garage and they had a lot too many bees.  Since I had been blowing out the garage earlier with the shop vac..eureka!  Worked awesome!

I think to get the air velocity that you need to clear a whole super at a time...that is going to have to be one strong air-flow out of the tube!!!  That would need to be like a desk-fan that would curl your eye-lids back!!!

Rick

[Robo]

I set the super against the side of the hive and use a leaf blower to blow the bees out,  it works pretty good, but you have to work fast the get the evacuated super sealed up.  There are tons of bees flying around after you blow them out, and a good portion of them will fly right back onto the super if you don't move quickly.

The other method I use to get any stragglers out,  is to stack the pulled supers and but a triangle escape board on top.  Then put a night light next to one of the escape board exits and put on a telescopic cover.  The light will draw them out the escape board and by morning the supers will be pretty empty of bees.  I have never had much luck with just leaving supers that where pulled.  A good portion of the bees tend to stay right there,  and this time of the year,  other bees start robbing quickly as well.

I don't believe you will get enough airflow out of a vacuum to make your second method viable.

[Understudy]

The idea of setting the super near dusk is nice. But I don't always get home at that hour. I wanted to be able to pull the boxes off today before I went to work. If I left them outside they would have had no honey in them by the time I got home.

So this is a nice method for those who may not always be home at dusk.

Grainger is a wonderful place to look for blowers and big motors.

Sincerely,
Brendhan

[Michael Bush]

>#1. The come isn't as well reinforced. I have a tendancy to do shake out of my bees. I will usually tap it against an empty hive body to get the bees to come out. Well I must have tapped a little to hard. I had three pieces of comb break in the frames. That was very discouraging.

You have to change your habits.  You can only shake them off if the comb is attached on all four sides and not brand new and soft.  But you can shake them off if you wait for this.

>#2 If I take out each frame to remove the bees it can be a time consuming process. Also my bees hate the bee brush.

I don't see a lot of difference between good brush technique and good shaking technique.  Either way a lot of bees are in the air.  The secret to good brush technique is to flick.  You are NOT trying to be gentle.  Being gentle will only roll them and make them VERY angry.

> They develop bad attitude if I use it. Also if I remove the frame the burr comb can break and spill honey which causes bees from everywhere to line up at the buffet.

I usually go for the abandonment method just before dark.  Pull the supers and after dark take them.

[Understudy]

I did put a super out when I got home just after my last post. I have a super full of bees. I don't think I like that method. I will blow them out in the morning hopefully before robbing starts.

Sincerely,
Brendhan

[Michael Bush]

Is there some brood in the box?  I put the boxes on end so both ends of the box are exposed on the sides.

[Understudy]

The box has no brood and is at a 45 degree angle and is about a foot from the hive.

Sincerely,
Brendhan

[Understudy]

And now it's raining.

:(

Sincerely,
Brendhan

[Brian D. Bray]

At the Hogwarts School of Beekeeping they teach that the proper brush stroke is flick and swish--Just ask Hermonie.

I only use the brush when replacing the top or supers so as not to crush the bees that might get pinched.

[ooptec]

I found using weeds made into a brush less aggravating to the girls than a bristle brush.

Not sure why but for me it worked and can brush them into the hive w/o them taking flight. My Carniolan HRH is usually the last off the frame as she is a hider    lol

cheers

peter

[Michael Bush]

>I found using weeds made into a brush less aggravating to the girls than a bristle brush.

They work ok.  A large goose feather or a turkey feather works even better.

[ooptec]

henh,

Live and learn, will have to try that

cheers

peter

[Cindi]

Ha, I have the soft bristle brush and the bees do not like to be brushed, flicked, whatever.  Now I am on a new quest.  I have to go out and hide, grab one of the great big white geese and pull out one of their feathers, so I can have a beautiful new bee brush.

Well, not exactly, I love to let my imagination run.  I am sure if I got out to the duck yard, I can find a great big quill, I think that is the best idea ever!!!!!  I know how soft they feel, yet I bet they can have the strength at the same time to flick those bees right off the comb!!!!  Have a wonderful day, best of our great life.  Cindi

[Old Timer]

i have an electric leaf blower that work well. i'll take a super and place it on end atop of a hive and blow them out. after they get blown out i'll take the super and run like heck, well more like a fast walk, but it's running for me. with the foundation not attached to all four sides of your frames, you could take some empty hive bodies and stack a few on the ground and put the super on these. you'd have to stack them in different directions to give the bees a place to fly out and for the air to go, but it would be better than leaving a super of honey out in the rain.