Spring Super Management - Need some advice

[misterz60]

My question is about managing supers in the spring.

Some background:

Last year was my first year keeping bees - single hive. Bees did fine and have wintered over just fine.

(They are in the Adirondacks in upstate NY, on the shore of Lake Champlain at my summer place, so I was worried about not being able to check on them over the winter ... but they are in great shape getting ready for apple blossoms nearby!)

I left the two deep and two medium supers stacked over the winter -- had honey stored in the mediums so I wanted them to have access to plenty of food. (from bottom to top: Deep, Deep, Med, Med.)

I opened the top of the hive, and the bees are in the top super.

I understand over the winter the bees move up in the hive. I'm not sure if they're in a column, bunched at the top, or what!

Now it's spring and I am unsure of how to manage the supers to ensure I have brood in the deeps and honey in the mediums.

What do I do?

[BMAC]

I would remove the supers from the stack and set them on the ground next to the lower bottom deep.  Pull out 4 frames and gently shake all the bees into the lower deep box.  Smoke them real well afterwards and to help spread the bees out in the bottom and replace the 4 frames.

Then put your hive back together and start checking for brood in your supers.  If there is brood in your supers you will need to put a queen excluder on and consolidate all the frames of brood into one super and place that on top of the queen excluder.  This will allow the nurse bees to care for the brood and allow the brood to hatch out.  Come back in 21 days and remove the super until it is time to pull honey.

[misterz60]

BMAC - Thanks for the direction. Can I play your advice back to make sure I have it correctly?

   - I pull out 4 frames from each of the shallow supers and move the bees into the bottom deep
   - Replace the (now bee-free) supers back into the shallows
   - If there is brood in the shallows put the queen excluder on top of the two deeps to prevent additional brood in the shallows
   - After 21 days the brood in the shallows will have hatched
   - Move the bees in the top shallow into the remaining supers and keep it off until the first honey flow.

I really appreciate this advice. As this is my first full year of beekeeping I find everything a little mysterious ... although it gets easier all the time ... and advice from experienced beekeepers helps!

[mark]

this is going to sound really unconventional but DON'T DO NOTHING BUT ADD NEW SUPERS FOR HONEY!  the bees not only move up but down and sideways when they need to.  you will have a healthier colony if you give them that much room for the brood nest.  contrary to opinion as you have found out they don't have trouble in winter with that much room - cold isn't a problem.  DON'T reverse brood boxes. IT ISN'T NECESSARY.  THEY WILL UTILIZE THE ROOM AS THEY SEE FIT. 

[misterz60]

Mark -
I already have two deep and two shallow on there ... are you saying: put another shallow on top during the honey flow and they'll fill it with honey? (as long as the tower doesn't topple over!)

[mark]

that's what i'm saying.  since 04  i winter them with 2 deeps and at least 2 supers.  they come into spring boiling over with bees in every box but the bottom super 'cause i leave the screen open all year.  they do use that box for excess nectar and pollen when they need to.   if all the supers are the same size it doesn't matter where they put brood as you can always just take capped honey and switch frames around.  with the brood nest that large they also out pace disease and pests.  i've not treated for anything since hiving the package in 04.

[mark]

to clarify .....make that bottom hive body instead of bottom super .

[Saltcreek]

I noticed you used Mediums for your supers. Since you have only one hive and not much equipment yet, I think now could be a good time to convert to using all Mediums for both brood nest AND supers as many have done. That way all your equipment is interchangable. I would REMOVE the Deeps if empty or cut out honey and put it in medium frames. Then I would leave the bees in the Two mediums for brood nest and add more mediums for supers as necessary. Three Mediums equal two deeps for what many consider a standard size nest. You don't need to waste the two Deeps. I ran mine thru the table saw to cut off the BOTTOM part so they were the same size as the Mediums. Then just get some more medium frames for the shorter bodies. With a small apiary it is much more convienient have all equipment the same size, and a lot easier to handle when they are full.

[mark]

saltcreek
that IS an excellent way to go and if I were starting over or even expanding i would only get mediums.  the deeps are there however and the point i would make is that you don't ever really need to move them with a healthy colony. in a few years start cycling out the old deep frames and replace with medium frames if you WANT. unless you are dying to tear the hive apart to see the queen or whatever why mess with success. they will draw extra comb on the bottom of the medium frames which can be cut off if ya need that frame in a medium box. when all the frames in the deep are mediums THEN you can cut the box down or just use it for a flower box. i am notoriously lazy and loath to do extra work when i don't need to.

[Michael Bush]

http://www.bushfarms.com/beeslazy.htm#stopswitching

[misterz60]

Mark - I like your advice, primarily because it involves me doing much less work.

I think I will buy another medium with frames and add it to the top of the existing hive for honey. When do you suggest I do that? I'm thinking in spring when the apple trees start blooming. Should I put a queen excluder under the new medium, just to be safe?

I will take the two medium supers off to look and see how much activity is going on in the two lower deep hive bodies. But then I'll reassemble it as is.

Then maybe next spring I'll buy a deep hive body and two more mediums and use that plus the extra medium as part of a second hive.

How does that sound?