heated hive cover

[tandemrx]

O.K., here is the scenario: 

I live in Wisconsin.  Obviously we get very cold winters.

the question is, will this project work (i.e. would it provide any heat to the bees), and would the bees benefit?

I have one of my hives in the back yard, and it is my "fancy garden hive", in that I kind of pamper it and trying to make it look nice in the back yard.  It does not have the greatest of populations going into winter because of a very late swarm, but I am leaving them with a full super and they have decent stores in at least the upper box.

I made a nice copper, peaked, hive cover.  All I did was take a regular telescoping cover and added on a peaked roof.  So there is an empty "attic" above the regular telescoping cover and under the peaked roof that is not accessible by the bees.

I just bought a doll house window (about 2.5 inches x 2.5 inches square) that I am going to put stained glass into the window and install it in the facing section of the cover.

My thought then is to put an access hole in the back of the "attic" and feed in a bunch of large size christmas lights.  Then I could plug in the lights and give a nice stained glass show from the hive cover.

My other thought is that maybe a bunch of those lights in the attic would provide some heat into that space that would not be too far from the cluster of bees.

I can't imagine it would  be a lot of heat, but it might take the chill out of the top bit of the hive.  This would of course be over the inner cover.  My original intention with the doll house window is purely decorative, but wondering if I put in more lights than I originally intended if it might do the bees some good (or harm?)

Here is the picture of the hive.  I will, of course, add shutters to the window as well  :-D



Most heaters I have seen for hives of course put the heat source below the bees so the heat would rise.  But I am not really planning on doing anything else to heat the hive - it just comes from this decorative idea.

[Creamhorses]

Nice looking hive.

Not sure how the moisture rising from normal respiration will effect the lights...maybee nothing, but good or bad, there's some great Christmas lyrics in the offing:  "Deck the halls with bows of honey, falalala..........

[AllenF]

If you put the heat in the top of the hive, it will bleed out the top, pulling cold in from the bottom and across the cluster.   People, when heating a hive put the lamps in the bottom and not much, like 1 - 7 watt light bulb or 2 at the most.   There are how to and pics here if you do a search on it.  Too much heat, and you will cook the hive or cause them to starve.   

[AllenF]

Good info here on how to heat a hive.

http://forum.beemaster.com/index.php/topic,9178.0.html 

[tandemrx]

again, main purpose isn't to heat the hive (I am not going to add a heater to the hive).

And not sure how it would "pull heat from the hive" - can't see the physics of this.  Remember, the lights won't be "in" the hive, they will be in the enclosed portion of the cover.  All the light would do is heat the top board of the cover and the air in the enclosed portion (which will be above the inner cover).

Moisture wouldn't have access to the lights really as the lights are in a hollow space separate from the hive.

I guess I will try it and see if it impacts the temperature of the hive anywhere in a test hive.

[AllenF]

Heat rises.  Do you have a hole in your inner cover? Does the attic above have cracks or holes to the outside?  Then as the heat rises out of the attic, it pulls in cold air from the bottom.   

But if you just want the stained glass look, go for it, but but in a solid inner cover. 

[Michael Bush]

Heat is an iffy proposition.  If there is too much they get too active, eat all the stores, shorten their lives and don't make it to spring.  If it's just right, it could get them through the bitter cold nights (assuming sub zero).  But that is difficult to arrive at without some careful planning and a thermostat.  Then your son unplugs it to plug in the guitar amp on the night it's -27 F...

[Finski]

.

Do a favour to the beehive and let them be in peace durig winter rest. Even you walk around the hive bees will be preare to fight for ther life. The hive temp will ris   up to 40C. It takes 24 hours that it turns back to clustre heat 23C.

[edward]

Nice looking hive !

The problem is not the cold in winter it is the damp and most of all the difference in temperature !

The bee know how warm to make there hive .
If there is a big difference in temperature it will result in a need for the bees to work harder to keep the climate constant in side the hive , the harder they work the more food they will eat.

Maybee you could use diode lights they don't give off heat

[buzzbee]

It would probably be best to just insulate the empty attic space. then the coldest part of the hive would be the side walls. If the moisture gathers there it will run down to the bottom board rather tha drip from the roof onto the bees.remember,moisture condenses on the coldest spot first. I would rather see it on the sides than the top.

[Finski]

.
I have heated small colonies over winter with 3 W terrarium heater. I put the heater over frame bars that bees collect themselves around the heat.  if you put it under the winter cluster, bees have no winter rest.  you see the result when you open the cover. My theory is that bees must be clustered and not walk around the hive.

Even 2 frame colonies do well with heating in a firewood shelter.

Normal hives do well in the insulated hive. It need no extra heating. Heating is more expencive than sugar. I use it only in Arpil and in May.

[tandemrx]

Well, here is the finished product (click images to enlarge):

Made a "stained glass" window of sorts as an aesthetic addition to my backyard garden hive.  Added a 15W bulb in the attic of this hive.  Again, this is a sealed space as the pitched roof was built over a standard telescoping cover.

I put a sensitive digital thermometer below tele-cover while it was sitting on a wood surface to see what, if any temperature effect it would have (wasn't expecting much).  I could not feel the heat of the bulb on the underside of the tele-cover.  At 63 degrees ambient temperature, the highest the thermometer ever got was 66 degrees (so effectively increasing the temp by 3 degrees in a very limited space of the volume of the under-side of a tele-cover).

I am expecting that with our now high temperatures in the high 30's (F) in Wisconsin, that much more of the heat is lost from the top-side of the cover (I could also not feel any temperature difference on the copper roof which is mounted on top of 1/2-inch plywood).

I have a piece of 3/4-inch insulation foam board above the inner cover of this hive, upon which sits the newly lit up copper-top hive cover.  So in essence I don't think the bees with notice any heat from the light (although it will probably provide a much warmer deadspace above the hive, so possibly provide some insulation benefit for our bitter winters).

I put the straw bales up just to break the north wind and to keep some of the snow drifts off the hive.  Used the stray bales for aesthetic purposes, at our apiary I  wrap the hives with foam board, but I didn't want to cover my nicely stained hive bodies (nor did my wife).

My wife loves the little lighted window in the evening and seeing the gleaming glow of our beehive.  It is our Xmas decoration of sorts.  We smile knowing the bees are out there and we are watching over them  :).

[gaucho10]

Where's the elevator :-D

[Finski]

.
I have heated hives but that makes no sence.  :? :shock:

[gaucho10]

I think the moral of this story (post) is just a nice Christmass setup.  It is cute but serves no purpose for beekeeping strategies.

[L Daxon]

tamdemrx,

I like the look.  I, too, would enjoy being able to look outside and see that little light on a snowy wintry evening. 

May not help the bees much, but who knows, every little degree of heat might help.

Thanks for sharing your handy work. Now I am in a Christmas mood.

Linda

[Bee-Bop]

I believe you answered your own question in your last post
" 3/4 in. foam insulation board between top cover and the hive cover "

Hive cover 3/4 in wood, 3/4 in foam, 1/4 in wood top cover.

I bet the bees won't feel any heat from a 15 watt bulb

Course what do I know   :?
Bee-Bop

[tandemrx]

well, actually, the top telescoping cover has a standard hardboard top to it (1/8th inch I think, on top of 3/4 foam on top of 1/8th inch hardboard of the inner cover).  but still unlikely the bees will feel extra heat. 

I still believe that it will provide a buffer zone on top of the hive that will benefit the hive (or at least make it more likely that if condensation occurs in the hive that it will occur on the side walls of the hive).  A heated dead air space I have to think is better than any other insulation material that I have used before on top of a hive.

But, like Idaxon notes, it is mainly about the look for my backyard garden "fancy" hive.  I am looking at the light right now from my office window and it warms the cockles of my heart as we approach that time where I won't see a bee for 3-4 more months.

Sense? It was one of the more fun projects I have done this fall . . . so it makes a lot of sense to me.

Now back to the more mundane projects of building regular hive bodies and frames for the spring and back to your regularly scheduled programming  8-)

[Finski]

.
One basic thing is that you have too much room for winter. 2 boxes are surely enough.
To avoid condensation? Your action is far over estimated. If you keep fun with that bulb I think that it  not funny to bees.