one more kinda dumb split question?

Kathyp · June 08, 2007, 06:40:33 PM

today i did my split. i think i did ok, but time will tell :-)

when i went to look at the brood frames i wanted to move, i could not find eggs. i could not find them anywhere, and then realized that i have not seen any eggs this year. obviously the eggs are there. i suspect i need a prescription change for my contacts :-)

i ended up picking two frames that had larva and brood and some open cells in the hope that i got some eggs in there also.

my question is..... if i need to add another frame, i'd like to take it from the other hive. if i do that, the odds of getting most of the workers off without damaging/dislodging eggs and larva are slim.

will i start a war of the workers in the hive if i end up doing this?

Michael Bush · June 08, 2007, 08:07:42 PM

>will i start a war of the workers in the hive if i end up doing this?

No.

Odds are you got eggs if you got brood.

asprince · June 08, 2007, 09:00:03 PM

Kathyp, Are you talking about useing bees from more than one hive for a split? I would like to know the answer to that. I plan to start a nuc this weekend. I want to use frames from different hives; honey and pollen from one that is honey bound and brood and eggs from another. If I transfer frames and bees, will they all get along for the common goal of raising a queen?

Steve

Kathyp · June 08, 2007, 09:03:41 PM

yes, that was the question. sorry if i was not clear. i have done the split, but if i need to add another frame of eggs, i don't want to take it from the original hive. i want to take it from another.

Michael Bush · June 09, 2007, 12:31:04 AM

A frame of brood can usually be added with no fighting. A few puffs of smoke will add some insurance.

Kathyp · June 09, 2007, 12:34:51 AM

thanks. i hope i got it right the first time, but that's good to know just in case.

tillie · June 09, 2007, 08:54:09 AM

The Georgia Beekeeper of the year, Cindy Bee, said that if you add a frame with bees from another hive to a nuc or a queenless hive, sometimes she sprays the bees on the new frame as well as the bees hanging out in the hive with sugar syrup flavored with anise or vanilla. It mixes up "their smellers" she said, and that keeps them from fighting.

Linda T in Atlanta

Kathyp · June 09, 2007, 01:32:26 PM

thanks linda. that's a good idea. won't be able to check on progress for a bit. weather is pretty wet for the next while. guess for the next week i'll do the queen cell dance as i go by that hive.

trapperbob · June 10, 2007, 11:00:57 PM

Just remember that the only dumb question is the one you didn't ask because you thought it was dumb.

Kathyp · June 11, 2007, 07:05:44 PM

well.....crap

the queen ended up in the split. first time i have seen a queen all year, and she's in the wrong place. not the end of the world, but i knew when i opened the hive that she was there. to many bees had moved over. found her and her product.

now, since i'm there, i open the mother hive. all brood is capped or hatched out, but no queen cells. i took two frames from hive 3 and gave it to hive 1.

how long does it usually take them to realize that they are queenless and need to do something? i figured they'd have started queen cells by now? hive 3 is the weaker hive and i hated to rob from them. as things stand, i'll have to rob from the "split" or recombine them if hive 1 doesn't wake up. :-x

asprince · June 11, 2007, 07:34:28 PM

Kathyp,

I split off a nuc yesterday. I shook bees from two hives and gave frames from two hives. Since my queens are no longer marked, I could not find them. I just pray that I did not shake in two queens. In an effort to keep that from happening, I shook the bees from honey frames and knocked off bees from the brood frames just in case the queen was on that frame. I will know in a few days.

In your case, can you put the queen in a cage and reintroduce her to her old hive?

Steve

Kathyp · June 11, 2007, 07:52:58 PM

switching the queen is more trouble that it's worth i think. i'll just let the old hive be the split and if they don't requeen themselves, i'll recombine the hives. on the up side, the queen that i accidentally moved seems to be laying well in the new hive. from the looks of it, she may be doing better in the new hive than in the old :-) go figure......

Brian D. Bray · June 11, 2007, 08:30:42 PM

Moving the queen to the split is like manufacturing a swarm. The old hive will think that is what happened. as long as it has eggs from which to select larvae for queen making you should be ok.

asprince · June 11, 2007, 09:20:58 PM

well.....crap is correct!!!!!

After reading your post, I decided to take a look in the nuc that I split off yesterday. I have never been able to find an unmarked queen in a hive........surprise, my nuc has a queen!! It is a lot easier to see her when she is one of a 1000 rather than one of 100,000. That fat girl stood out like the moon amoung the stars.
Now I have a mini hive and at least one queenless hive. Unless advised otherwise, I will wait a week or two to see what the hive will do on it's own.

My plan was to start a nuc and let them raise me a spare queen.

Steve

doak · June 11, 2007, 09:40:39 PM

The best way to do a walk away split, is to devide the colony in two equal amounts, both in full size 8 or 10 frame bodies, whitch ever is used. The one that takes up a new space will most times end up with less bees. To remedy this, take a couple frames from the mother hive that has the brood and the nurse/house bees will be on those frames and will not return to the old location, shake the bees off in the new split and returnn the frames to the old hive. Make sure you have a frame with all stadges of brood, most likely it has eggs, in each box/hive.

"But" this is not necessary if you are lucky and find the queen. Then you have to make sure you have eggs in the new one.
I talk too much.
doak