The D.E. Hive???

[mlewis48]

  Hello everyone!
In my web surfing search for bigger better ways to help the girls and to get more out of them. I came across the D.E. Hive web page. Looks good, sounds good but it claims to boost production to 85%? Does anyone have those and are they that good? Just a thinking about getting one of the kits to convert one of my Langs over to it. If anyone has tried or is using them let me know if they are as good as they say they are.                 Thanks again,
                               Marcus

[KONASDAD]

many people say they are excellent, including MB. But, they are not uniform and i cant use my present frames and as such wont make the  switch. Cant afford to lose the drawn comb I have worked so hard to get.

[Robo]

The Langstroth modification kit does work well improving the ventilation of the hive.  However it does not address the propolis and cross bracing issues that the DE Hive does.  I purchased a mod kit many years ago and have since used a similar design to add a ventilation box to all my hives.  I still have a few hives that have the frames perpendicular to the entrance,  but most of my new ones are back the traditional way.  David also has strong belief of solid bottom boards and that they keep the brood chamber warmer and more humid than with SBB which is a less ideal environment for varroa.  I believe he may be onto something and have moved back to solid bottom boards with slatted racks.  I also have kept with traditional telescopic covers as I find the vented ones are too bulky and the vent box provides sufficient ventilation.

[Jerrymac]

David also has strong belief of solid bottom boards and that they keep the brood chamber warmer and more humid than with SBB which is a less ideal environment for varroa. 

Build a closed box, open on top,  to sit the SBB on this keeps everything closed to the weather but allows the mites to fall out of the hive and not be picked up by the bees again.

[KONASDAD]

[Build a closed box, open on top,  to sit the SBB on this keeps everything closed to the weather but allows the mites to fall out of the hive and not be picked up by the bees again.

A super w/ a bottom?

[Jerrymac]

A super w/ a bottom?

Yeah. But it wouldn't have to be very deep. 1 or 2 inches.

[Brian D. Bray]

A slatted rack accomplishes the same thing.  Even if the bees could crawl back up through the SBB there is still the slatted rack to negotiate before they can get to a bee to hitch a ride.  That's an Everest size climb for a mite.  Also the slatted rack provides a thermal layer of air, stablized by the rack, that keeps the hive warm.

[Finsky]

  Looks good, sounds good but it claims to boost production to 85%?

As far I know, Kanadian use same hive construction like USA. Walls are cold, non insulated.

Ventilation is not the key to build up of hive. There are many things.

My 45 years experience say that temperature of hive box is essential
I changed my boxes to styrofoam because hives developed earlier to the age of  foraging.

Second is the pollen store of hives. It means that pastures have pollen very late.

The final point in hive box temperature revieled when I start to use in spring electrict heating.

Pollen feeding 1 month earlier + electrict heating + nature willow pollen makes hives build up 3 times faster than in normal way. My average yield jumped 80%.  But this year, It was 1996 when I last got so small yield.

But when I have had cold weathers and bees do not get pollen from nature during 3-4 weeks, brooding collapses.


But if colonies swarm strongly, you will loose everything what you have build during whole year.

And if you want good yield, +200 - +400 %, take hives to splended pastures. 
If you have too much bees in one place,  smaller gang  forages same yield from same pasture. - or they must fly too far.

To say, that whole years' effort depends on ventilation of some box or ..., beekeeping is not so simple.

.

[Michael Bush]

http://www.beesource.com/ubb/Forum12/HTML/000194.html
http://www.beesource.com/ubb/Forum12/HTML/000056.html
http://www.beesource.com/ubb/Forum2/HTML/000367.html


Here's what I like about the DE hive:

o It has good ventilation (but you can use the Langstroth kit to provide this for your Langstroth hive)

o It has the frames running so you can stand behind it to work it. (but you can get this in a Langstroth by using the kit)

o It has a system that almost eliminates having to break frames loose. This keeps the bees calmer, especially when working the brood chamber. (this you cannot get by using the Langstroth kit)

o It is nice dimensions from the bee's perspective. It's a square box and has 11 frames that the queens fills out nicely. (this you cannot get from a standard Langstroth hive)

o The frame design is very light, very strong and very good at keeping the foundation straight in the frame. I wish I could get such well designed frames for a Langstroth.

o The DE frames are really light to handle.

o The DE frames are dimensions such that you almost never have to use a capping scratcher.

o The long end bars are really nice for handling the frames, especially when you're extracting but also when you're working a hive.


What I don't like about the DE hive:

o My biggest irritation is that it is not a standard size. This is no end of frustration when you see something really useful, but it won't work with them. Like a nice triangular bee escape or a top feeder or a bound queen excluder. I get around it a lot by building things that are universal. e.g. a bottom board with 1 1/2" edges instead of 3/4" that is sized long enough for a Lang. I can put either a Langstroth or a DE on it. I built several adapters and often mix the DE supers and Langstroths. Also since it's not standard I can't buy stuff already assembled when I'm short of supers or hives and don't have time to build them.

o There's this space around the ends of the top bars, that the bees can't get to when the hive is closed. The purpose is to keep the bees from propolizing the ends of the bars. My problem with them is the bees run into them when I have the hive open and I can't get them out. Shades of the Arizona, they get trapped in there when I put the covers back on or a super on.

o I did have to modify my extractor to fit them. Maybe some wouldn't but the top part of the rack was spaced too far, so I had to get three threaded rods and replace the ones that came with the extractor. Now it works for either DE's or Langstroths.

o The long end bars (which are so nice to handle) stick down more so you can't have as much honey in the tank before they hit the honey and bog down the motor.

o It takes practice to not knock off the little plastic spacers on the ends of the bars when you're uncapping. It's kind of frustrating to be looking through a bunch of cappings for missing ones.

o Did I mention it's not standard size?

As you can see there's more I like than don't, but the big problem is the non-standard size.

[mlewis48]

 I like the design of the D.E. but as you all  have said, it is not standard size. I don't need that. It is hard enough to keep everything that I have in order. I think that I will try to mix the 2 and come up with my own version of it. I like te idea of the frames going cross ways, it has to easier to work with. The vent box, would a 2 or 3 inch spacer work for that? Just a thought. Too much time on my hands. I hate the long months of winter. After finding all of the hive designs that are out there, my Tim The Toolman side has kicked in. After a few wasted boards, I have been able to make my own boxes, slatted bottom boards, and just about all that I need, except for frames. I tried and with my limited skills, it would be cheaper to buy them. I think that if I stay busy building things the winter will go faster, just a thought.

[Michael Bush]

You can buy the DE kit for the Langstroth, or, as you say, just build one.  It's not a hard concept to turn the bottom board 90 degrees and provide top ventilation.  David has perfected the ventilation system, but it's also a bit expensive.

[Robo]

Here are some drawings of what I came up with based on the DE mod kit.  This was prior to going back to solid bottom boards with slatted racks, my preferred setup now.






I like to keep the vent box the size of a medium super,  then you can get a quart feeder in there.  I also like to cut the frame rests in now too.  It makes it easier to store the odd frame when queen rearing or to get them cleaned out.



I also have the Langstroth modification kit assembly instructions here -> http://robo.bushkillfarms.com/beekeeping/downloads/

[Finsky]

.
I am not fond of hive constructions. They do not bring honey. Only pastures do.

Hive constructions are just for beekeeper. Out of stardard means extra work which have no value.

Nice and nice. Langstroth or what ever, bees stay there or they escape  :lol:

How ventilation is problem in Canada?   - Others insist madly that they use only screened bottom.
During my whole beekeeping years beekeeper have developed bottomboard, slatted racks, inner covers and what ever.
I don't see much diffrence on those. Just is it handy to use and practice migrative beekeeping.

Ventilatilation I get when I drill holes in front wall in every box
.

[mlewis48]

 Rob,
  Thanks again for the link with the prints. This will give me something to do, this weekend when the snow falls. I think that I wil go with your responce on the lids, they look like they could weigh a ton.  I will make a couple of the mod kits to use when Spring gets here.

[Hopeful]

D.E. Hive? Is that the Dwight Eisenhower Hive? The Dangerously Elevated Hive? How about the Dire Emergency Hive?

Really, is it possible to say what it is using real words for, say, the first time, and then initials after that? For example: "HSC (Honey Super Cell) is a great product."

Just a suggestion from a green horn who has no clue what is being talked about.  :?

[Robo]

D.E. Hive? Is that the Dwight Eisenhower Hive? The Dangerously Elevated Hive? How about the Dire Emergency Hive?

Really, is it possible to say what it is using real words for, say, the first time, and then initials after that? For example: "HSC (Honey Super Cell) is a great product."

Just a suggestion from a green horn who has no clue what is being talked about.  :?

Yes, D.E. Hive.   That is what it is called.
http://www.beeworks.com/d_e_hive.html

David Eyre is the inventor. 

[Hopeful]

So the initials in this case are the actual name? I've got a lot to learn.  :roll:

[Robo]

Don't feel bad, you can't easily search on it to see what else exists out there on the subject.   Most forum search engines don't like words of 3 letters or less much less initials.  So the lesson to learn is to always make sure your product name is 4 or more letters if you want to take full advantage of the internet.

[Jerrymac]

Go here and you will find a few explanations of abbreviations

http://www.bushfarms.com/beesglossary.htm