Broken frame in a new hive question

[tillie]

I got a swarm on April 1 and since this was entirely unexpected, hived it in a box I had set up on my deck as a swarm lure.  The box had old, used frames in it, was full of wax moth damaged comb, etc. 

The bees went to town housecleaning and had it all put to rights the next day.

When I opened the box to check out how they were doing at the end of about a week, I realized in trying to lift it out that one of the frames is broken.  I didn't lift it out because to do so risked a full comb of bees and brood falling to the ground.  The bees congregated in frames 1 - 5 on one side of the hive box and this is frame #2.

I checked the hive yesterday (second inspection) and while they appear to be building up like crazy, they still are only on frames 1 - 6.  The last four frames are old plastic foundation.

Two questions:
1.  Should I go ahead and give them another hive box to encourage them to move up and out of this messy one?
2.  Other than learn the lesson that I should always GLUE as well as nail the frames, should I keep leaving the broken frame alone with a note to self to replace it once the hive has moved up?

Linda T always learning in Atlanta

[JP]

Linda, could you take some of the frames out adjacent to #5 and replace #5 with a good frame? You could do this temporarily if you wanted to while you repair the broken frame. Am I making sense?


...JP

[bassman1977]

I had a that happen to me last year.  It was a frame my dad gave me, which wasn't glued.  The top bar came apart on one end.  I just got around to replace and repair it last week.  It was in the brood box and luckily there wasn't a whole lot going on at or around that particular hive.  The frame never did cause an issue, I just couldn't inspect it, which was fine.  I marked it in the hive has being broken and got to it when it was easiest for the bees.

[pdmattox]

I like JP's suggestion and will add that I would move the brood nest to the center of the box then place new empty frames on each side. Doing this will alow them to grow out.  It sounds as the unused frames may not have enough wax on them if they were wax moth damaged. Are your hives ten frame boxes?

[tillie]

I can take frames 7, 8, 9 and 10 out and replace them with starter strips.  I'll try that today on solid frames *(not broken).  I can't move the broken frame because it's heavy with brood and this is a new swarm - can't afford to lose that work.

I am planning for the next box to be an 8 frame box.  Michael Bush had suggested that I could put an 8 frame on top of a 10 frame and cover the outer two frames ( 9 and 10) with a 2 X 4.  I've got the cut 2 X 4 and am prepared to do this - I could scoot the frames 1 - 6 over one and add a frame of starter strip in position 1 and position 8.  However, broken frame #2 isn't going to scoot - so I could lift out what is currently frame 1 and move it but not 2, if you understand my problem.

If that's the solution and I am going to be encouraging the queen to use 8 frames anyway, maybe I should fix the two outer frames in the current box, add a second medium 8 frame and cover the open space with a 2 X 4 today.

Linda T confused and concerned in Atlanta

[randydrivesabus]

i would just leave the broken frame as is for now...maybe write broken on the top of it to remind myself. when the frame is free of brood i would then replace it or fix it. you can see whats going on it by removing its neighbors.

[Michael Bush]

Usually you've got an end bar the came loose.  Is that what you have?  If so you can repair it sometimes when you get the chance.  Just nail things back together and put it back in.

[tillie]

The end bar is detached from the bottom bar - or at least that's how it feels when I fool with it.  I can't fix it until the bees have moved up into another box. 

I went back into this hive today and took out the icky plastic foundation frames and substituted frames with small cell starter strips.  Then I moved everything over one frame (including the broken one) and put in another starter strip frame on the side of this hive.  Now maybe they'll like their home better.  They were festooning away drawing comb and didn't appreciate my opening the hive two days in a row, but I feel a whole lot better.

Linda T relieved in Atlanta

[Brian D. Bray]

Some good suggestions given.  If it were me, i'd work the broken frame to the outside of the box where I could remove it.  Once it's the outer most frame the bees will not use it for brood and convert it to storage use, then you can remove it, cut out the comb and honey if necessary and then repair it.
I use 2 1X2s, 1 on each side, when putting smaller boxes atop a larger box as it keeps the boxes center and reduces tip over possibilities.  I have made and open top than works as in inset for putting nucs atop my 8 frame boxes.  Works great for holding gallon feeder cans (2) or when putting a nuc over a larger box--I over winter 1 hive by putting a nuc box of honey frames atop the 8 frame brood box using the inset top.

[Ross]

Just stand the box up on end, smear some glue on the end of the bottom bar and press it in place.  No need to remove the frame to glue a bottom bar back in.