How to Dissolve a Colony?

DayValleyDahlias · May 04, 2008, 08:03:08 PM

As you all may remember I hived a swarm on 3/17..this poor little colony just cannot make a queen, I checked today...it looks awful in there...tons of drones, no evidence of queen anywhere, something that looks like maybe a swarm cell on the bottom of a frame...

I have no time to give them a new queen and I don't even want to deal with giving them brood...whatare the steps to let this one go...

Would I shake out?

May I shake out in the early evening?

How do I shake out the bees???

Thanks

deejaycee · May 04, 2008, 08:12:23 PM

Could you not just do a newspaper combine with one of your other hives?

Seems the simplest way round and gives the bees a second chance.

DayValleyDahlias · May 04, 2008, 08:28:15 PM

How would I do that? A newspaper combine...I like that idea

JP · May 04, 2008, 08:31:33 PM

Sharon: "I have no time to give them a new queen and I don't even want to deal with giving them brood..."

My response: Why not give them a chance, some hope, by giving them some brood. You said they have already tried to make a queen cell, they may be successful next time around.

...JP

DayValleyDahlias · May 04, 2008, 08:34:41 PM

Okay I just read...

So all i need to do, it to take the weak hive and place it atop the strong one with newspaper in between...

The strong hive currently has 2 deeps, may I just place the weak hive atop the 2nd deep?? Is that okay???

I like this idea...only think is I may have to do it in the evening because I WORK :-x

DayValleyDahlias · May 04, 2008, 08:38:56 PM

JP, I am afraid they are too weak to even raise a queen...I Like the combine idea though. I am working til 5:30pm and can't break into the strong hive I would like to combine them with ...AND I am leaving town for a week...so I can't even buy them a queen...

JP how about the combine thing??

JP · May 04, 2008, 08:48:13 PM

Quote from: DayValleyDahlias on May 04, 2008, 08:38:56 PM
JP, I am afraid they are too weak to even raise a queen...I Like the combine idea though. I am working til 5:30pm and can't break into the strong hive I would like to combine them with ...AND I am leaving town for a week...so I can't even buy them a queen...

JP how about the combine thing??

Check them well before the combine. If they are really weak, they may have shb issues or waxmoth already. If no apparent problems then combine. If you see issues, remove all combs and then do the combine. You don't want to pull a strong hive down.
Good luck.

...JP

DayValleyDahlias · May 04, 2008, 08:58:38 PM

JP,

I did have a look earlier today. No signs of any disease at all...no brood, lot's of drones...

deejaycee · May 04, 2008, 09:07:48 PM

Sorry, got distracted.

Yes, that's basically it for the newspaper combine.

I use two sheets of newspaper. Put a couple of 'stabs' through the paper with your hive tool to give the bees something to get hold of and chew out. (make sure the stabs go between frames so they are accessible to the bees). Don't make big holes - you want them to have to chew their way through rather than just stroll on in.

I've done it twice so far - no problems either time.

good luck :)

DayValleyDahlias · May 04, 2008, 09:47:08 PM

Thanks I did it...here's to luck!

When should I check for results? I am going out of town Wednesday back on Monday late...should I wait that long, or have a look Tuesday early eve?

buzzbee · May 04, 2008, 10:06:40 PM

Watch outside the entrance,you'll see the bits of paper showing up there

deejaycee · May 04, 2008, 10:09:58 PM

they're through and settled in a matter of three days or so in my experience and from what I've read.

When I went into mine a week or two later the bees had removed all the paper bar what was caught between the edges of the supers, so really there's no rush to go in and do anything once they've been combined - the bees will tidy up quite nicely.

The only thing that would make me go in soonish (eg, under a week) would be that on the second one we had a fair bit of rain, and the newspaper sort of leached moisture in between supers. It wasn't anything to speak of, just noted a bit of mold around the edge of the supers where the paper was when I went in next.

DayValleyDahlias · May 04, 2008, 10:45:17 PM

Fantastic, thank you all for your help and support...I sure hope it works out for the bees, a much nicer way than to shake 'em out and let 'em fly...

Who knows maybe some day I will do a split...LOL :roll:

sarafina · May 05, 2008, 12:15:08 AM

I am still learning the ways of the bees, so this is a question for the more experienced beeks.....

Wouldn't the presence of so many drones be an indication of a laying worker and that is why they haven't made a queen from the brood she has given them?

What happens to a laying worker when combined with a colony with a laying queen (i.e. newspaper combine)? Will the laying worker just quit laying eggs because of the pheromones from the queen?

Brian D. Bray · May 05, 2008, 10:58:40 AM

Quote from: sarafina on May 05, 2008, 12:15:08 AM
I am still learning the ways of the bees, so this is a question for the more experienced beeks.....

Wouldn't the presence of so many drones be an indication of a laying worker and that is why they haven't made a queen from the brood she has given them?

Not necessarily, there are such things a drone laying queens, virgin queens that mated late or old queens which had low matings. Laying workers are more readily identified by multiple eggs in each cell with the eggs laid on the sides of the cells, not bottom center.

QuoteWhat happens to a laying worker when combined with a colony with a laying queen (i.e. newspaper combine)? Will the laying worker just quit laying eggs because of the pheromones from the queen?

Ideally the workers from the queen right hive erradicate her. The normal event is that the presence of a true queen will inhibit the laying worker or cause the other workers to reject a laying worker. BTW a laying worker hive has a lot of laying workers not just one, could be up to 100 or even more, the exact number is hazy.