Waxwork

[FRAMEshift]

I'm wondering what bees do to attach wax to other materials, including existing wax.    I recently read that bees can attach wax to a wooden comb guide more strongly than it would be if I painted melted wax on the guide.  That really surprises me because surely the bees can't melt wax at a temperature of 140F.  Do the bees chew the wood and mix the wax into the structure of the wood?    I also wonder if newly produced wax scales are more malleable or reactive than older wax.  That might explain why bees don't reuse wax, which has always seemed very wasteful to me.  And bees are not known for being wasteful.  Anybody know anything about wax?

[BjornBee]

That might explain why bees don't reuse wax, which has always seemed very wasteful to me.  And bees are not known for being wasteful.  Anybody know anything about wax?

I know bees DO reuse wax.... ;)

[G3farms]

I use wood frames and wax foundation and if even if they don't start pulling comb out right away I have noticed that they will stick the foundation to the wood with propolis at the wedge and at the bottom bar.

Yes bees will reuse wax and propolis, I have seen them scavenge it from equipment on my porch.

G3

[deknow]

exactly what they do, i don't know.  i do know that if you paint some melted wax onto wood, it's often easy to peel off.  now, try peeling off wax that bees have attached to the topbar.  see the bottom of this page:
http://thecompleteidiotsguidetobeekeeping.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=88:foundationless-frames-how-to&catid=73:beekeeping&Itemid=92
...and you can start to get an idea of some of what they do.

deknow

[FRAMEshift]

 see the bottom of this page:
http://thecompleteidiotsguidetobeekeeping.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=88:foundationless-frames-how-to&catid=73:beekeeping&Itemid=92
...and you can start to get an idea of some of what they do.
deknow

Thanks.  That is impressive. Such structural engineers.  My daughter gave me this book for father's day.  It's not that detailed but the basics are there and I have learned some new tricks.

[FRAMEshift]

I know bees DO reuse wax.... ;)

Yes bees will reuse wax and propolis, I have seen them scavenge it from equipment on my porch.

G3

KathyP.... where are you? :-D  Well actually this makes more sense.  I guess if they wouldn't use old wax, they would not draw out foundation would they.   So if I do crush and strain, should I put the wax back in the hive to be recycled?  Has anyone tried this?

Yes, I had heard that propolis is used to add strength to wax structures.  That may be part of the answer.

[Scadsobees]

In the summer they make enough wax that there is not any reason to put the cappings back in.  They won't use it for the most part.  They do recycle wax from parts of combs to build up others.

Use the extras to paint onto bars or plastic foundation if you use that.  Or make lotion or shoe polish.

[deknow]

...glad you liked the book.  believe me, if there wasn't a page limit of 208 pages, it would have been more detailed (as it was, we got them to increase the page count).  we plan to build the website to fill in any holes, and to provide the details.

deknow

[G3farms]

No don't stick it back in the hive, it will just be fodder for SHB and wax moth. I guess I need to explain more of what I have seen, it is not like they will reclaim pounds of wax to reuse but more to the point if they happen upon some they will use it. I watched them reuse a golf ball size wad of burr comb, it took the about four days to tear it apart and fly off with it. Had a top that had fresh new propolis all over it and it took them a week to clean it off. This was in the spring of the year also.

It would be best to put all of your excess wax in the solar melter for future use.

G3

[BjornBee]

You can see the reuse of wax throughgout the year in many ways.

Honey being capped in late summer or fall many times is capped with dark wax. It's not that the bees are making dark wax, it is due to the reuse of older wax being reclaimed from unneeded areas of the hive. Sometimes it's from the edges of comb, sometimes extra burr comb, etc.

Ever see a frame of wax foundation get "chewed" up in late summer. Of course this is the old-timer name for it. Some suggested the bees got "bored" and chewed or even "ate" the wax. Which is baloney. What they do is strip foundation and other areas of unneeded wax and reuse it to cap honey and build comb in other areas. Sometimes you can even see new dark comb on foundation as they start to draw comb. Bees are not stupid and are not wasteful.

Get an observation hive. You can see how they move comb around, how they reuse wax to cap late honey stores, etc.

Which makes the whole use chemicals in the brood chamber questionable as per labling instructions. Like using chemicals then two weeks later placing supers on, keeps the bees from transferring the chemicals into the supers...yeah right!  :roll:  And they move honey from the brood chamber up into the supers all the time.

Of course all this comes from a religious zealot nut case of a beekeeper....or so I've been called. But I also know that there are others who would prefer NOT to eat contaminated honey. If it goes into the hive, regardless of WHEN you put your supers on, you will have it in your honey, via wax and honey transfer.

[FRAMEshift]

...glad you liked the book.  believe me, if there wasn't a page limit of 208 pages, it would have been more detailed (as it was, we got them to increase the page count).  we plan to build the website to fill in any holes, and to provide the details.
deknow

Yes, you did pack a lot in a small space.    I haven't looked in detail at the website, but if it starts where the book leaves off, that would be very useful.  I will be recommending the book to friends. 

One point that really fascinated my daughter (she read it before she gave it to me)  was the idea that adult workers have no repair mechanisms (top of page 23) so they don't need protein.  I got the impression that the adults are finished machines that just eat sugar for fuel until they wear out.  Very cool.

[FRAMEshift]

Which makes the whole use chemicals in the brood chamber questionable as per labling instructions. Like using chemicals then two weeks later placing supers on, keeps the bees from transferring the chemicals into the supers...yeah right!  :roll:  And they move honey from the brood chamber up into the supers all the time.

I completely agree with you.  We use no chemicals  on our hives.  But I guess it surprises me  that the bees don't reuse even more wax than they do.  I think I read somewhere that it takes 8 lbs of honey to make 1 lb of wax.  You would think, with a ratio like that, the bees would be scouting for all the wax they could find.

[deknow]

One point that really fascinated my daughter (she read it before she gave it to me)  was the idea that adult workers have no repair mechanisms (top of page 23) so they don't need protein.  I got the impression that the adults are finished machines that just eat sugar for fuel until they wear out.  Very cool.

this is essentially the case...there is a small amount of "finishing" that happens when the worker emerges (and still eats some beebread and i believe some larval food), and protein is fed to foragers in small amounts (this is part of the feedback mechanism that tells the colony how many foragers to assign to pollen collection).

deknow

[FRAMEshift]

deknow, I've registered on the CIG website.  Looks well put together.  Thanks for doing this.