the frame after crush and strain

stella · August 08, 2011, 11:06:44 PM

I took one frame of honey from my top 8 frame deep. I replaced it with an empty new foundation frame. I have scraped the honey off the frame and am wondering what I do with the frame now.
Do I place it, with honey residue on it, back into the hive where the new empty frame is?
Do I need to clean it first?

The honey is to die for! I sat and watched my first ever honey drip out of the cheesecloth all afternoon while chewing on bits of honeycomb. I love my new hobby!

JP · August 08, 2011, 11:19:44 PM

Take the empty frame out and put the extracted frame back in by all means. They will clean it up and draw it out if in a flow of any kind.

...JP

Michael Bush · August 08, 2011, 11:20:14 PM

No need to scrape the frame, just put it back on the hives.

Shanevrr · August 09, 2011, 08:20:27 AM

please dont laugh, but I dont really understand crush and strain. Wouldnt you want to save as much comb on frame as posible to help with faster honey production next go around. Also so bees dont have work so hard to draw it back out, which means less feeding?

If its about getting wax, dont you get a lot from uncappings? Who knows maybe Im missing something. Smack me if you wish :-D

stella · August 09, 2011, 09:43:26 AM

Thanks JP and Michael. I will put the frame back in the hive today.

I was able to scrape off some nice pieces of comb intact that Ill be putting in the little jars with some honey for sharing. I wont have much to share but if I give out samples I might build a future customer base. ;)

mikecva · August 09, 2011, 10:29:02 AM

Shanevrr, an extractor is the best way to get your honey (IMHO) as you leave the most comb for the bees.

There is a scratch and heat method where you remove the capping and then heat the frame to 100 F and let the honey drip off. This is slow, not very efficient and messy but you still have the comb.

Crush and strain has been used since men have collected honey. Yes you lose the comb but if you leave the frame in the hive after collection the bees get to work and have the frame built out very soon. I used this method years ago with my uncle who would cut out all but the top inch so the bees would have a head start on rebuilding. -Mike

D Coates · August 09, 2011, 10:37:40 AM

Quote from: Shanevrr on August 09, 2011, 08:20:27 AMI dont really understand crush and strain. Wouldnt you want to save as much comb on frame as posible to help with faster honey production next go around. Also so bees dont have work so hard to draw it back out, which means less feeding? If its about getting wax, dont you get a lot from uncappings?

The fact that you destroy the comb is the huge downside to crush and strain. Flipside, you don't have the cost of an extractor and your comb is always fresh. If you're into honey production crush and strain is not an economical (energy exerted by the bees) way to go. If you've only got one or two hives and have no interest in getting anything beyond what you can eat and give away to your neighbors crush and strain may be for you.

AllenF · August 09, 2011, 05:33:34 PM

And always let bees clean up the frames, extracted or comb cut out. Either in the hive or out in the open for open feeding.

sc-bee · August 09, 2011, 07:40:54 PM

I have seen several different figures on using drawn comb vs new foundation and how much wax per pound in relation to honey loss. Some say it is not the set back some folks claim. Anyone have any real hard figures that are up to date?

AllenF · August 09, 2011, 10:25:54 PM

Wiki says 10 pound of honey to 1 pound of wax. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beeswax

I thought is was 8 pounds of honey.

ccar2000 · August 09, 2011, 11:25:39 PM

How many drawn frames do you get from a pound of wax?

stella · August 10, 2011, 12:02:01 AM

I only know what I see. I havent weighed the wax but it is , for sure , not a pound to 7 cups of honey. 8 pound frame before I scraped it.
That said, the bees had drawn out the newly inserted replacement frame about a quarter inch in less than a day and a half when I went to put the scraped honey frame back in. Wow, what workers!
They have got the fall groove on!

Michael Bush · August 10, 2011, 12:16:28 AM

>Some say it is not the set back some folks claim. Anyone have any real hard figures that are up to date?

http://www.bushfarms.com/beesharvest.htm#expenseofwax

stella · August 10, 2011, 11:53:03 AM

That was very informative Michael. Thanks for the link.

Algonam · August 10, 2011, 07:15:15 PM

Stella,
You reminded me of another frame question.........

I don't have an extractor so we will be crushing and straining. At the end of the season what do we do with the messy frames after we crush, strain and consume the honey? We won't be putting them back in the 3rd level of the hive as this level will be removed to set them up for winter.
So, the question is : Do we keep the sticky frames for Spring or do we clean out these frames and replace the foundation?

VolunteerK9 · August 11, 2011, 12:00:08 AM

You can place the frames in a hive body above the inner cover on your hive and the bees will clean them up for you. Then just take them off in a few days when they are dry. Next year, the bees will use what was left in the frames as starter strips (provided you didnt cut it all out at the top).

L Daxon · August 11, 2011, 12:45:44 AM

Several thoughts:

What kind of foundation are you using? If you are using plastic, then of course you are scraping the the wax and honey off the plastic and will have wet foundation left over. If you have wax foundation inserted on wood frames, I usually cut the entire frame of honey out into a big pan, leaving about 2 rows of cells all the way around the permiter of the frame as a guide for the bees to use to be able to then go foundationless next time around. This way you don't have to mess with putting in new foundation. Saves time and money. I usually then cut out the prettier parts of the cut out comb to make comb honey. The rest I crush up with a potato masher and then strain it through cheese cloth or pantie hose. Don't even have to decap it as you would if your were going to put it in an extractor.

Now most of the people above have said to put the wet frames back on the hive, but I thought I had always heard/read to be careful about doing that because it could cause robbing. Instead you can set the wet frames 50-100 feet from the hive and the girls will find them quick enough and clean them up lickety split. Not only will they clean up the frames but your pan and utensils as well.

I then put the cleanedup, dry as a bone frames in the freezer for at least 24 to 48 hours and then store them in an airtight container or plastic bags till I need them again next spring.

Michael Bush · August 11, 2011, 01:17:29 AM

>please dont laugh, but I dont really understand crush and strain. Wouldnt you want to save as much comb on frame as posible to help with faster honey production next go around.

If you have an extractor, of course. If you don't it's very expensive to buy one new. It's also less work and less time to do crush and strain than to extract if you only have a two frame hobbyist kind.

> Also so bees dont have work so hard to draw it back out, which means less feeding?

All good theory with no facts to back it up. But you will get more honey with drawn comb, not because of the cost of making wax in honey or calories, but because of the cost in time. When there is a flow on they will make a lot more honey if there is somewhere to store the nectar than if they have to build the comb first.

Algonam · August 11, 2011, 07:21:56 AM

Wax foundation is what we have. I've been wondering about foundationless. It their own foundation strong or is it fragile to handle?
Just a though to try out on a couple of frames next year.

Michael Bush · August 11, 2011, 10:43:43 PM

>It their own foundation strong or is it fragile to handle?

http://bushfarms.com/beesfoundationless.htm

All new comb with or without foundation is fragile. Without foundation at first it won't be attached on the sides and bottoms which means you have to not turn it sideways.