Attack of the Giant European Hornets

CWBees · August 23, 2007, 06:33:13 PM

I was checking my mating nucs today and there were two "Giant European Hornets" trying to pick off my bees. I saw two of my bees fighting with one of these a while back and one of the bees ended up getting carried off by the hornet. I grabbed my camera to get a few pictures of these two characters. They appeared to even be going after the yellow jackets on the ground around the hive.

One was trying its best to get in the hive since I suppose it would easier for them to snag a bee. The hornet tryed to get in by the screened vent hole so no luck for the hornet.

I also had one facing off with me for some reason. Maybe he did not like the camera or me.

http://www.vespa-crabro.de/hornets.htm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hornet

Cindi · August 23, 2007, 08:26:09 PM

CWBees. Those are some nasty looking hornets. Doesn't it boil your blood when you see a poor little bee being carried off by one. I have a vengence against the yellowjacket, a direct result of watching one carry of one of my girls last year as she tried to guard the hive entrance. Grrrrrr....Have a wonderful day, greatest of life. Cindi

annette · August 23, 2007, 08:51:50 PM

While we are on the topic. The hornets are getting nastier now and more coming in the evening. Last evening I watched 4 hornets harrass my hives. The girls are winning lots of the battlles but watched, as you did, as a hornet grabbed a bee and carried it to a small bush near my hive. I watched as my bee was being eaten. Another hornet landed on the ground and one bee immediately jumped off the landing board and onto that hornet. There was a tussle and then the hornet flew away very fast. My little girl died on the ground. She probably stung that hornet. It was very upsetting to me. I did place a trap near the hive with beer, but the hornets never went inside it. What kind of set up do you use??

This was a simple plastic jar with a cover and the cover had large enough holes for the hornets to fit inside. Today I went out and bought another glass wasp catcher where the hornet has to go up from the bottom and gets caught inside.

I may try MB recipe of vinegar, banana peel and luncheon meat.

Annette

tom · August 24, 2007, 01:44:07 AM

Hello

I have not had this problem this year with the hornets but what i did was take a 2 liter bottle and put some sugar banana peelings and some vineger in it and let it set where it was warm and started to smell like wine then i cut a hold at the base of the neck and hung it in a tree in my yard and bot did i catch a mess of them. And i have not seen any more hanging around my hives as for yellow jackets i am going to fix them also even thou my girls have been killing a mess of them if one lands on the board they are soon snagged by my girls and killed i have these big wasp looking things hanging around too with orange looking antena but they seem to looking for something else they don't bother my bees.

Tom

Bennettoid · August 24, 2007, 02:25:45 PM

They are tearing up my hives as well. One snatched a bee out of the air right in front of my face yesterday. I will hunt for their nest this winter after the leaves drop and blow it to bits.

annette · August 24, 2007, 04:31:32 PM

The nest, I believe, will dissolve on its own. They only last one season

Annette

Bennettoid · August 24, 2007, 05:04:32 PM

Ah, ok, its the baldfaced hornets with the huge nests I come across occassionally while hunting?

Zoot · August 25, 2007, 12:09:27 AM

I have a nest right under the platform that 3 of my hives are on. They hunt my bees at will and the only method I've found to be effective is to stand next to the hives with a flat board and swat them as them come by. Quite effective actually, they make a very satisfying "whack" when you connect. The nest is inside a cinder block and has resisted my efforts to get at it . I've been reluctant to use any chemicals so close to the hives.

Cindi · August 25, 2007, 10:24:06 AM

Annette, others, that is awful about the predators attacking the bees. Some of my yellowjacket traps are like the glass one you bought, Annette. It is two pieces that fit together and has an entrance on the bottom, the wasps go up and in and drown in the fluid. Mine are plastic though, but a very great investment.

I have tried the 2 litre pop bottle with an entrance on the side. Critters paid absolutely no attention to it whatsover. I disgarded them, waste of time. I am catching these hideous bald faced hornets more than the yellowjackets the past few days, and it is a very satisfying thing. They are over double the size of the yellowjacket and I know from experience, far more aggressive.

There must a short note given on how lifespan of hornets, wasps, yellowjackets. If you live in a zone where it is not summer all year round (smiling), this is basically how these lives are lived. The colony basically dies off in the wintertime. The impregnated queen finds a spot to hibernate over the wintertime. She comes out in warm weather in spring, finds a new home, lays, her eggs, they hatch, they begin brood rearing. At the end of summer the colony dies, the impregnated queen hibernates. Simple as that.

Any nest that you find in the fall is not used over. In particular, the bald faced hornet. Their nests do fall apart in the cold and moisture of winter. THey build new homes in spring.

I wish there was a simple answer to protecting the hives from these wasps and hornets. Good luck to you all. Right, I have also spent hours at the apiary with a flyswatter in my hand. That works pretty good to knock the wasps down, but then I usually have to finish them off by squishing them in my fingers, and believe me, that brings me even greater pleasure :-D Have a wonderful day, Cindi

annette · August 25, 2007, 11:58:58 PM

OK here we go again.

Made the glass trap today with banana skin chopped up, luncheon meat chopped up and vinegar. Placed the trap up about 10 feet away from my hives. It attracted lots and lots of yellow jackets, but alas, not one hornet!!!

The hornets were still harassing the girls this evening and not going to that trap. Does the trap have to be closer to the hives for the hornets to smell it??? I did not want to place it so close to the hives.

Let me know if there is anything more I can do to get rid of these hornets. I am about ready to give up and just accept. The hornets have also figured out where my bees drink their water and they go after them at the pond also. This breaks my heart even more than when they are up at the hives, because I know my little girls need to drink and the hornet is keeping them from drinking. I usually just pray for the hornet to catch one bee and just go on their way and let the others drink. This is what usually happens.

Anymore advice appreciated, or I will just accept this. I can see that the hives will be ok, just sorry they have no peace every evening, or at the pond sometimes.

Annette

Zoot · August 26, 2007, 12:10:00 AM

Whatever you do don't try going after their nests at night. They are efficient night fliers, even with minimal light. A sting from one of these things is quite painful.

Cindi · August 26, 2007, 12:34:08 AM

Annette. I hear your plight and it is breaking my heart too. I can't stand predators, of any kind, and there are many in this world.

YOu probably have heard on this forum about robber screens to preventing hives being robbed out. What about some kind of this like that that could keep your bees safer from these pukes!!!!

I know there isn't much you can do at the pond, but maybe something like this. Can you try it? Could you kind of make a little screen thingy that the bees could get out and the wasps couldn't figure out how to get close? My heart goes out to you and I know how sad it can make you feel when you feel so helpless.

Do not give up, start thinking about things, I bet you can think of something really ingenious, just think hard about it. The wasps are probably going to be around for some time yet and anything you can do can help.

I also wonder. I saw at our home hardware store a "pretend" wasp nest. Evidently, wasps are territorial and if they see another wasps nest, they won't come around. I don't know if it works or even if it is available in your area. I wish that I could give you more sound advice and that you can get rid of these hideous beasts. Gook luck, Annette. Have a wonderful day, girl. Cindi

annette · August 26, 2007, 01:38:55 PM

It is not really a robbing situation that would warrant the use of the robber screen. That robber screen should be a temporary fix for a serious robbing problem. This is really just a few hornets flying around my hives every evening and picking off a few bees. It is not really a robbing where they are trying to get into the hives and could finish off the hives in a few hours.

Perhaps I am making more of it than I should. I do find 1-2 dead hornets on the ground every morning, which means the girls are winning some battles also.

Thanks for all the help. Right now the 2 hives are doing pretty good and I feel lots of peace from this.

Annette

hilltop hives · August 27, 2007, 01:40:54 PM

I had a lot of trouble with these last year. I probably killed serveral hundred and they kept coming. A badmitton racket does a great job. I would stand off to the side of the hive and swat them as they came in for a bee. Don't miss because they don't have a sence of humor and their stinger measures a half inch, no beesuit can stop it. A couple of other place I found to get them was on any trees that are seeping sap and outside lights at night. They fly at night so don't think you can destroy their nest then even if you can find it which I never did. I used to leave my porch light on at night and during commersails I would check, most of the time there would be two to three catching moths. This spring I killed maybe a dozen that were a lot larger than the ones last year and since then I haven't seen a one. I guess I got the queens before they could set up house keeping. From what I've read their like other wasps and hornets in that only the queens over winter. Another thing I found out is that each colony can contain 1,700 hornets which on average can catch 30 honeybees a day.

annette · August 27, 2007, 02:09:27 PM

If they are flying at night, does that mean they are harrassing my bees all night long????

Annette

hilltop hives · August 27, 2007, 02:34:01 PM

I never actually saw any around my hives at night but they are attracted to light. What got me to notice this was my wife, Im hard of hearing but my wife can hear a bug crawling a hundred feet away. On night she kept hearing a noise at our kitchen door which is all glass. Well naturally I didn't but when I checked I found one of these hornets catching bugs off the door. When I turned out the light it left but as soon as I turned it back on it was back. You can hear them coming, compaired to a honey bee they make a low humming sound kind of like a B52 bomber.
By the way I put out every trap suggested and they would even look at them. On the bright side they do also catch yellow jackets and other hornets.
My bees did kill several of them but they paid a heavy price.

CWBees · August 27, 2007, 06:36:12 PM

There is some good info at this link on European Hornets and beekeepers.
http://www.vespa-crabro.de/hornets3.htm
Apparently they are not that detremental to the hive and eliminate many insect pest.

And according to thes site http://www.masterbeekeeper.org/stinging/aerialyellowjackets.htm the bald faced hornet which regardless of the name is not a hornet

"Dolichovespula maculata is a North American insect which, despite commonly being called the bald-faced hornet (or white-faced hornet), is not a true hornet at all. It belongs to a genus of wasps called yellowjackets in North America, and is more distantly related to true hornets like the Asian giant hornet or European hornet, but the term "hornet" is often used colloquially to refer to any vespine with an exposed aerial nest." http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baldfaced_hornet

and yellow jackets are beneficial insects.

"Benefits: Both bald-faced hornets and aerial-nesting yellow jackets control many harmful insects, such as crane flies, flies and caterpillars."

From this site.
http://unexco.com/gallery/hornets.html
"Hornets are predacious insects, which means they eat other insects. For this reason, they are beneficial insects and if they are up and out of the way, you might just as well leave them alone."

The European hornet is actually a protected species in Germany since its population had dwindled.

woodchopper · August 27, 2007, 09:28:44 PM

Quote from: Zoot on August 25, 2007, 12:09:27 AM
I have a nest right under the platform that 3 of my hives are on. They hunt my bees at will

After reading this I'll be checking our hives up in Maine alot better this weekend. Last time we were up there I saw a few hornets under our three hives. Never thought to check for a nest under there. Thanks for the idea.

Bennettoid · August 28, 2007, 10:03:14 AM

Quote from: CWBees on August 27, 2007, 06:36:12 PM
There is some good info at this link on European Hornets and beekeepers.
http://www.vespa-crabro.de/hornets3.htm
Apparently they are not that detremental to the hive and eliminate many insect pest.

And according to thes site http://www.masterbeekeeper.org/stinging/aerialyellowjackets.htm the bald faced hornet which regardless of the name is not a hornet

"Dolichovespula maculata is a North American insect which, despite commonly being called the bald-faced hornet (or white-faced hornet), is not a true hornet at all. It belongs to a genus of wasps called yellowjackets in North America, and is more distantly related to true hornets like the Asian giant hornet or European hornet, but the term "hornet" is often used colloquially to refer to any vespine with an exposed aerial nest." http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baldfaced_hornet

and yellow jackets are beneficial insects.

"Benefits: Both bald-faced hornets and aerial-nesting yellow jackets control many harmful insects, such as crane flies, flies and caterpillars."

From this site.
http://unexco.com/gallery/hornets.html
"Hornets are predacious insects, which means they eat other insects. For this reason, they are beneficial insects and if they are up and out of the way, you might just as well leave them alone."

The European hornet is actually a protected species in Germany since its population had dwindled.

That may all be true, but they are still scarey, horrid beasties.

hilltop hives · August 28, 2007, 10:08:40 AM

I never actually saw them around the hives at night but they are attracted to lights. As a matter of fact I read somewhere that a guy made a trap with a spinning fan blade and a light behind it. I've watched them catch moths and other bugs around my porch lights. You can actually hear them coming, they have a low deep hum. It kind of reminds me of the old B52 bombers. They also fly slow which makes them easy to hit. Be advised that if you miss they will come after you. There's a lot on the internet about them. I'm just glad that I haven't had to deal with them this year.