tales of a novice beekeeper

Jow4040 · October 06, 2014, 02:12:39 AM

Hi All,

My Name is Joe, I'm from Australia and for right or wrong, have dived into beekeeping head first.

Let me start by saying i am a total novice who up until this point had only interacted with bees through the honey on my breakfast.

I thought this thread might be a good way to catalog my miss adventures as i get into the hobby and get some pointers along the way. I am definitely open to suggestion and would love any advice more seasoned people could offer.

This last winter (I'm Australian and its spring now) i built myself a 8 frame langstroph hive and super and started to look at options for getting some bees.

So i built a bait hive in the hope i could catch a swarm. A good friend has a house that each year a swarm arrives at to make residence in their air-conditioner. I baited the swarm trap with lemongrass oil and rubbed bees wax all over the inside in the hope that some bees might find the 10 frame super a good sized home.

As luck would have it though, the minute i delivered it the hour or so away from my house, i was told by another friend that a swarm was in a local park only minutes away.

I was completely unprepared and had nothing to house them in but a cardboard box as the hive i had built over winter was being stored else where and the bait hive was already a long way away.

Despite the spur of the moment decision, I packed the car with my jacket, a ladder and the cardboard box and headed out. By this stage it was about 9pm. I managed to locate the swarm hanging onto the underside of a leg thick branch about 4m off the ground.

I positioned the box under the mass and as gently as i could began scooping bees from he branch with my gloved hand. As luck would have it, i got 95% of the bees into the box in the dark and once it was all taped up i loaded things into the car and headed home. It was close to 11pm at this stage so i placed the box in the backyard and cut an entry hole into the side for some air.

That evening i discovered that my bee jacket was not in fact bee proof and the pants i had worn were also far from sting resistant. I managed to not only get my first sting since i was a kid but also 10 or so more.

The following day the bees seemed quite happy, they were making what looked like orientation flights and were coming and going from the entrance in an orderly manner. That afternoon I decided it was time to relocate the bees from the cardboard to the hive i had. That's when things started to go wrong. I put the hive in a small alcove that had some other household and gardening things being stored there. I thought this would be a good place as it was sheltered but also got some sun and was out of the way of the daily goings ons of the garden. i removed some of the middle frames from the hive and opened the cardboard box. The bees were hanging in a cluster on the lid so i positioned the box over the hive and gave it a sharp tap with my hand like i had seen countless beekeepers do on youtube. Two thirds of the bees fell into the hive and the other third fell amongst/into all the junk that was being stored around the hive. I immediately wished i had chosen a clearer location to do the transfer. Bees were everywhere, flying, in buckets, clinging to an old folding table and caught in an old painting dropsheet. I got a few of the really badly stuck bees out and tried to get them into the hive.

That when I noticed that the bees in the hive were fanning their wings. I had read this can mean they are sending out pheromones to call in the rest of the group to the queen, so i assumed that the queen was in the box and the rest of the bees would find their way in in time. To cut a long story short, they didnt.
I left them over night to sort them selves out and the following day they had mostly climbed out of the hive and were clustered in and around all the junk.

I got out the dust pan and brush and began sweeping them up as best i could and put them back into the hive. I got most of them back in but as careful as i was a few bees were crushed in the process. I ended up with so many bees massed in the box that i decided not to place back the remaining frames until the hive calmed down a little more as they were at this stage very agitated. I was planning on doing that this afternoon but when i looked at the hive there were around 50 workers clustered to the outside front face of the hive and more flying around.

I thought at first that they were going to leave the hive and swarm to somewhere else but when i looked more closely i noticed that most of the bees were facing backwards and were actively fanning their wings. Also the flying bees were not as they first appeared, flying around the same area but actually many bees coming and going from the hive.

I think they are finally settling into their new hive even if it is a few frames short.

I can see that if i was to do things again, already there are many things i would do differently. It's funny how quickly you learn when you do things with your own hands. No matter how much you have read or seen in videos hands on is by far the way to go.

So having said that, now i want to place the remaining 4 frames into the 8 frame hive. When would be a good time to do this? should i wait a couple of days? First thing in the morning? I am thinking the longer i leave it the more chance there is that they are drawing comb from the lid or elsewhere where i don't want it.

When i looked under the lid today the bees were hanging from a cluster under the lid. Should i give the lid a good knock before taking it off to dislodge them?

I have worked out my jacket issues and feel i am much less at risk of stings then my first attempts, so smoker at the ready i am ready to go, I think i just need a few pointers.

Joe.

Rmcpb · October 06, 2014, 04:31:54 AM

Joe,

Welcome to the madness. Now you need to open your hive and put the other frames in there or you will end up with a mess of comb. Just lightly smoke the entrance, lift the lid a bit and a few puffs and close the lid. Let them get a good breath of the smoke then take the lid off. Put the frames in and gently brush any bee on the lidd into the hive or bump them off BUT do it in a clear place, you don't want to lose the queen.

Good luck
Rob.

Jow4040 · October 06, 2014, 04:39:54 AM

Thanks for the quick reply Rob,

I raced out and fired up the smoker. i gave the lid a thump after giving a few pufs of smoke and heard the cluster fall to the floor of the hive. I then lifted the lid and quite easily slipped in the frames. The bees were surprisingly tolerant of this. I got the lid back on and will now leave them to their own devices for a while.

What sort of time should i leave them to draw comb before i check for larvae, pollen etc? a couple of weeks?

BeeMaster2 · October 06, 2014, 06:46:53 AM

Quote from: Jow4040 on October 06, 2014, 04:39:54 AM
Thanks for the quick reply Rob,

I raced out and fired up the smoker. i gave the lid a thump after giving a few puffs of smoke and heard the cluster fall to the floor of the hive. I then lifted the lid and quite easily slipped in the frames. The bees were surprisingly tolerant of this. I got the lid back on and will now leave them to their own devices for a while.

What sort of time should i leave them to draw comb before i check for larvae, pollen etc? a couple of weeks?

Jow,
Welcome to beekeeping.
A good interval for inspections is 10 days. You can do it at 7 day intervals but 10 is better. The main purpose of your inspections this year is for you to learn what they are doing. The less you disturb your bees, the better they will do.
Jim

Rmcpb · October 06, 2014, 07:21:16 AM

Joe,

Jim is right. One of the real problems with new, and many experienced, beeks is that they keep digging in the hive for no real reason. Imagine if someone kept taking the roof off your house and rearranged the furniture. You would be really stressed and a bit savage. Same with the bees.

With my backyard hives I open them every couple of weeks for a quick check, and I mean quick. With these hives I find I spend a LOT of time watching the entrance and seeing the pollen going in and the clumsy, fully loaded nectar bees bumping their way in. Also, the general activity will tell you lots and their behaviour. If they are fairly tolerant of you standing there things are good, if not it could indicate a problem. The other indicator is the scent of the hive, it should be a sweet honey smell any sour smell would indicate a problem.

It may be worth moving that hive into a more open space with sun before they get too settled in. Its a LOT easier to work a hive in the open when you are not tripping over bits n pieces in the process.

Where are you located? Just a general area is OK but it make any advice more targeted.

Cheers
Rob.

Jow4040 · October 06, 2014, 08:16:53 AM

Thanks for the advice guys, Ill give them 10 days or so before i go back in to poke about. I have very much enjoyed watching them today going in and out of the entrance so i can happily keep doing this to get more familiar with their behaviors.

I'm located in Melbourne but may be moving to the central victorian highlands in the next 6 months or so. Its very similar weather wise although it does get colder over winter.

Thanks again guys, i will keep this thread updated as i go and hopefully i can call on all your expertise.

Joe.

iddee · October 06, 2014, 08:24:38 AM

Don't wait 10 days to replace the missing frames. Do it immediately. In 10 days you will have comb, honey, and brood hanging from the inner lid.

BeeMaster2 · October 06, 2014, 12:21:21 PM

Quote from: iddee on October 06, 2014, 08:24:38 AM
Don't wait 10 days to replace the missing frames. Do it immediately. In 10 days you will have comb, honey, and brood hanging from the inner lid.

Iddee,
See post #2.
:)
Jim

iddee · October 06, 2014, 03:18:52 PM

OOPS. Asleep at the wheel.......

GSF · October 06, 2014, 10:23:14 PM

Welcome Joe

BeeMaster2 · October 06, 2014, 11:45:18 PM

Quote from: iddee on October 06, 2014, 03:18:52 PM
OOPS. Asleep at the wheel.......

Seeing the time of your post, I suspected you just did not have your coffee yet. :-D
Jim

Michael Bush · October 07, 2014, 09:15:41 AM

I would warn you away, but I think it's too late for you now... catching a swarm is the most addictive thing you can do...

Jow4040 · October 08, 2014, 02:10:24 AM

Hi Michael,

By coincidence, a couple of days ago, while procrastinating and researching bees at work, i ordered your book. I look forward to reading it and slowly transitioning to a foundation-less hive. We don't have Varroa here in Australia as yet but we also didn't used to have any Asian honey bees. They have slipped the customs net and not doubt varroa will as well at some stage in the future so getting a hive or two running strongly and prepared seems like good sense to me.

Catching the swarm was a lot of fun and i can see how one might get addicted to it. I still have my bait hive out so who knows, i might land another one once this spring weather warms up again.

Joe

Jow4040 · October 08, 2014, 06:10:14 AM

Captains log,

Day 3: I arrived home from work today happy that daylight-savings now means that the bees are still working when i get home. I was able to observe the bees coming and going from the hive for a while between arriving home and dinner.

The hive had a really nice honey smell emanating from it and the bees were coming and going calmly and didn't mind me sitting within a meter of it.

I saw bees entering the hive doing two things. First some of the bees returning had bright yellow pollen on their leg baskets.
The other bees i saw returning had no pollen and were landing much more heavily or kid of crash landing onto/into the hive. sometimes they were hitting the front face of the hive and then falling to the ground below the hive stand. I have heard that sometimes bees do this when they have a heavy load of nectar on board and are not able to fly gracefully. Is this true?

So from observing these two behaviors today what can i assume is going on inside?

I am guessing that because the bees are out gathering pollen and possibly nectar that there is now comb drawn and or being drawn in the hive. I am guessing this is a reasonable assumption?

As the bees are foraging does this also mean that there is queen present as they have reverted to normal behavior after swarming?

Is there anything else i can tell from these observations?

Thanks for all the help so far, i am looking forward learning as i go with all your advice.

Joe

Rmcpb · October 08, 2014, 06:21:37 AM

Sounding good. The honey smell is good, collecting pollen is supposed to indicate brood rearing, tolerant of your presence indicates a queen (settles them down) and the full nectar bees are just good entertainment.

Can you move the hive to an open, sunny position?

Jow4040 · October 08, 2014, 06:45:11 AM

hi Rmcpb,

Sounds like the signs are looking good so far.

As far as location goes, do i want the hive to be in full sun, part sun, morning sun etc? what is the ideal location?

Rmcpb · October 08, 2014, 07:27:15 AM

I try to set mine up on the south side of some trees so they get shade in the middle of the day and they don't get too hot. Don't be too worried about it though, sunny is good and you can put insulated, ventilated lids on them to keep the heat at bay. I use a Warre style quilt with a vent on my hives.

Sunny is good with some dappled shade for the hot parts a bonus.

Cheers
Rob.

mikebrg · October 08, 2014, 10:10:37 PM

Joe

Thanks so much for the adventure so far, I am hoping to start my first hives in the not to distant future and while I have done so much reading and researching I cant wait to get into the real deal! We have a club meeting this weekend and I can't wait to get there, I'm like a kid in a candy store !

I don't know if its the sadist in me but I had a good laugh at the overloaded bees missing the runway :evil:

Mike

Rmcpb · October 09, 2014, 12:51:11 AM

I kind of have a soft spot for them too Mike. They come bumbling in, miss and crash. Often they lay on the ground for a few seconds and I am sure they are wondering who was moving the entrance all over the place.

you will be hooked soon too.

Rob.

Michael Bush · October 09, 2014, 09:17:26 AM

>The other bees i saw returning had no pollen and were landing much more heavily or kid of crash landing onto/into the hive. sometimes they were hitting the front face of the hive and then falling to the ground below the hive stand. I have heard that sometimes bees do this when they have a heavy load of nectar on board and are not able to fly gracefully. Is this true?

Yes. Sometimes they crash because they are not used to it yet. They will get better.

>So from observing these two behaviors today what can i assume is going on inside?

Hmmm... maybe nothing you can assume.

>I am guessing that because the bees are out gathering pollen and possibly nectar that there is now comb drawn and or being drawn in the hive. I am guessing this is a reasonable assumption?

Probably because of the nectar.

>As the bees are foraging does this also mean that there is queen present as they have reverted to normal behavior after swarming?

Bees always forage.

>Is there anything else i can tell from these observations?

Not really. They will gather pollen with or without a queen and with or without brood. They will gather nectar if it's available.