How can I get 8-frame medium poly hive equipment?

[cjlong]

I am very interested in trying a poly hive.  Ideally, I would like to run 8 frame mediums to match all my existing equipment.
It seems like I have three options:

1. Find a supplier (So far, no luck)  Is there a supplier that makes them?
2. Alter an existing poly hive like a Beemax.  If I can get either 8-frame, or mediums I would be willing to do the alterations.
3. Find a source for the same type of poly material.  I am perfectly willing to build my own.  Does anyone know where to get the same kind of material?

Thanks.

[bwallace23350]

What is a poly hive?

[Troutdog]

I am very interested in trying a poly hive.  Ideally, I would like to run 8 frame mediums to match all my existing equipment.
It seems like I have three options:

1. Find a supplier (So far, no luck)  Is there a supplier that makes them?
2. Alter an existing poly hive like a Beemax.  If I can get either 8-frame, or mediums I would be willing to do the alterations.
3. Find a source for the same type of poly material.  I am perfectly willing to build my own.  Does anyone know where to get the same kind of material?

Thanks.

Paradise poly hives were making 8f last year. Don't know if blue sky still has em.

Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk

[Yukon Bees]

buy the standard 10 frame poly boxes and add a ~1" inch hd styro insert at either ends to fill in the gap from 10 to 8 frames...

[cjlong]

buy the standard 10 frame poly boxes and add a ~1" inch hd styro insert at either ends to fill in the gap from 10 to 8 frames...

Good idea.  I hadn't thought of that.

I've been assured that you can cut them down and re-glue them, good as new.  I have a table saw, so I can get good clean cuts.  I am going to try cutting them down first.

Thanks.

[Yukon Bees]

I'm assuming you will build your own bottom board.

[cjlong]

I'm assuming you will build your own bottom board.

Yes.  I've been building all my own equipment with 2x lumber for the cost-savings, and doubled R-value.  An R-value of 1.3ish doesn't compare to R 6.5.
The nice thing is the Beemax looks like it will match fairly closely with my existing bottoms.  If not, I'll build new ones.

Incidentally, the other reason for poly hives, is my oldest daughter has shown some interest in beekeeping.  It would make it easier for her to move boxes.
Does anyone what an empty Poly med box weighs?

[Yukon Bees]

Here are my measurements for my Paradise Honey Polys

[cjlong]

Here are my measurements for my Paradise Honey Polys

Thanks for detailed weights.  It is really nice to see the wood and poly side by side.

[eltalia]

"I am very interested in trying a poly hive"

Here (BMA) and elsewhere I have kept my yap shut on the topic
of poly (insulated) boxes as like the default use of mediums
it is something that is going to take years to change to what
should/could/would work for those b'keeps in 'temperate' climates.
Discussing that change only brings angst to the desktops of some.
Not my intention here, in any way shape or form.

I post to applaud your decision to at least try, moved to post as you
mention R factor and appear to recognise the importance of this
in insulating the hive walls/roof/bottomboard from the elements
of weather, hot or "cold". "R" is the patriarch of the whole family of
insulating factors, a measure used for the common MAN in comparing
that which they are buying as heat transfer control.

https://www.thermaxxjackets.com/insulation-ratings-r-factor-k-factor-c-factor/

What many - not just b'keeps - fail to understand is there is no such
quantifiable thing as "cold", such is simply not measurable.
What does exist is an absence of Heat, joules of it, or
British Thermal Units (BTU) if you like.
So.. regardless of where in the NH temperate climes a b'keeps job is to
keep the heat in, not keep the "cold" out. The tired old line "bees
clustering stay warm" is pure nonsense as the reality is bees cluster in
an attempt - often vain - to extend their heat into the envionment, the
cell body and wood. An organism trying to be a spaceheater. As many
have found - and will find -  many such colonys fail in engineering their
environment.
Were the beekeeper to use a product and/or construction which retained
the heat within the hive body - that is, not allow heat to leak from the walls
etc - 99% of wintering hazards would be eliminated.
One path, starting point, is use of poly hive bodies.

Lucks with your efforts and I would strongly recommend keeping
of actual recorded data in hive weights and feed quantities as part
of your trial.

Bill

[Yukon Bees]

I've been using them up here in the Yukon for the past 4 years with good success... As the chart below shows, I have crazy winter temps to deal with and every extra  R helps the girls make it through winter. This hive is still alive. The culprit this year is likely to the hive being full of honeydew honey and me being away from home from mid August to mid September and not getting to my winter feeding until late. This was also my 1st year getting honeydew honey - I usually get clear fireweed honey so I never knew about the high ash content and the higher risk for dysentry.

[Acebird]

Can you explain the yellow and green traces.  It appears the green has taken a sudden nose dive.

[Acebird]

I post to applaud your decision to at least try, moved to post as you
mention R factor and appear to recognise the importance of this
in insulating the hive walls/roof/bottomboard from the elements
of weather, hot or "cold". "R" is the patriarch of the whole family of
insulating factors, a measure used for the common MAN in comparing
that which they are buying as heat transfer control.

The devil is in the details Bill.
The major heat loss to a box is in moisture ventilation.  A styro box will not transmit much at all so I would expect a higher humidity in a styro box vs. a wooden box.  The nut to crack in my view is to control the ventilation such that the heat loss is diminished.  In my area that is done by the bees.  They will open up or close down air passages because we have swings in temperatures where they can move within the hive.  In far north areas the bees never get a chance to break cluster and make adjustments.  So they have to be acclimated to the area to make the preparation they need to make it through their long cold dearth.  It is my belief that the beekeeper in these areas should not put one finger on the hive when overwintering.  The only way I can see a beekeeper physically heating a hive and have any chance of doing it right is to bring the hive inside and that is an expensive ordeal because heat is the least of the problems you will face.  Ventilation will be the hardest nut to crack.

[Yukon Bees]

Notes for chart above:
Green line is the bottom brood box (Temp)
orange line is the top brood box (Temp)
blue line is temps from my weather station at the hive location

Another bee kill (hive still alive however). This one was likely triggered by the last 3 days of extreme cold (-35C to -43C). I took fresh samples of bees this afternoon to check for Nosema later (I've seen lots of poop on the hive so I want to see if it's disease related or plain dysentry caused by high ash content stores). Notice how the green line (bottom brood box) had been steadily rising above 33C (35C is the brood nest temp). The cluster wasn't able to maintain the temp and a bunch of bees died - "altruisic death" (fresh 1000s) and the bottom brood box has been abandoned. It will be interesting to check this hive out in the spring (not till March or April). Due to being away from home from Mid August, I wasn't able to start my winter prep until mid September. Lots of dark honey and they hardly took any sugar syrup in due to early winter. My goal is to understand the probable causes (disease or bee burn out (running out of steam trying to keep the hive warm) or food (hive is filled with Honeydew honey) or diurnal fluctuations at extreme lows). The reason I am noticing dead bees this year vs previous years is the new addition of a top entrance (for moisture control) on my winter setup. They now have an easier way to vacate the hive as the bottom entrance usually ices up at these temps. (However, I have much less humidity than previous years inside the hive).

[Acebird]

Humidity and temperature are very closely related.  You can't vent the humidity without losing the heat.  It is a tough balance to control.