Queen caretaker called

[beepro]

Hi, All!


Earlier in the season I took my expensive queen at the verge of dying with not much hive population to
a Russian guy I met on CL.   He promised to take good care of her.   Well, he called yesterday to say that my queen is ready in a
5 frame nuc hive.  Apparently, he and his bee buddy took my queen to the almonds run.   This is the only way that they don't have to
constantly baby sit my dwindling hive.   At the almonds there is a chance for  this  hive to build up.    Now that the almonds run is over, the
bees are all back to their original location. 

For my expensive queen, I am glad that she is alright.  Saved from the jar of death!   To compensate for their effort I will pay them $125 for this
nuc.  It is less than the market value per nuc hive this year.   Looks like I've made another bee friends or 2.

[Acebird]

Can you recognize this queen?

[BeeMaster2]

Did he have this queen in a hive for the almonds?
If so he made approximately $200. Off of that hive for pollination.
Jim

[splitrock]

Jim, respectfully, I don't think they pay much if anything for a weak hive on the almonds.   

[GSF]

They could put a weak hive in a regular box, does anyone look at the hives? I had someone on CL contact me wanting to buy every hive I had.

[BeeMaster2]

Most of the growers now inspect the hives and only pay for the ones that have, I think, 4 to 5 frames of brood in a 10 frame deep full on bees. If the Beek has weak hives they combine them to make a paying hive.
Used to bee the growers just were paying per hive but they were not getting good pollination even with lots of hives per acre. They had some expert beeks teach them what to look for and now they inspect.
Jim

[Van, Arkansas, USA]

{Can you recognize this queen?}

Ace,  If memory serves me correctly, the queen that Beepro was trying to save was a Cordovan.  So yes, Beepro could recognize the queen.
blessings

[Acebird]

Van, her daughters might look the same or any other cordovan.

[Acebird]

I think, 4 to 5 frames of brood in a 10 frame deep full on bees.

Just thinking out loud, wouldn't a broodless hive be better for their purpose?

[Van, Arkansas, USA]

Ace, yes maybe the daughters look the same.  However if the Cordovan queen was open mated, most likely the drones are not Cordovan therefore the offspring would all be itialian or whatever.

I do have Cordovan queens that by chance mated with Cordovan and itialian drones producing both Cordovan and itialian workers.  Cordovan are kind of a beautiful bee to me as they lack any black coloring, they are all yellow and brown.  But understand breeding bees for color alone would be a terrible idea.  May work for cats and dogs, even horses but not honey bees.

I do have 2 Cordovan alpha hives that possesses outstanding genetics.  They have built up nicely in preparation for the flow which begins in a week or two.  I have other hives that the queens are building up very slowly, waiting for the flow to begin before they crank out the workers.  Guess which hives I am going to raise queens from?  In humor I say, in humor.  Lol
Blessings

[Acebird]

most likely the drones are not Cordovan therefore the offspring would all be itialian or whatever.

Is that the way it works?  A Cordovan mixed breed would never look like a Cordovan?

[BeeMaster2]

I think, 4 to 5 frames of brood in a 10 frame deep full on bees.

Just thinking out loud, wouldn't a broodless hive be better for their purpose?

Actually no.  The bees get mostly pollen and a little nectar from almonds. If they are only looking for nectar as they do when bloodless, they will likely go farther for a better nectar source than the almonds. Brood requires a lot of pollen and makes them better  pollinators
It is something the almond producers have learned the hard way. Weak broodless hives are terrible almond pollinators.
Jim

[Van, Arkansas, USA]

Ace {Is that the way it works?  A Cordovan mixed breed would never look like a Cordovan?}

Exactly: Yes Ace, that is correct.  In this case a mixed breed is defined as one parent does not contribute a gene for Cordovan coloring.
Blessings

[eltalia]

Soooo... there is no Russky Sekrit Kiss(RSK), just SOP - as I have
just done myself in moving a developer colony onto 40 acres of sunflower.
Mind you the paddock flooded shortly thereafter so who knows if even the
hive body still exists!
As to paying them or not?
Let the market dictate.. I doubt the Russkys will get rich being nice guys
in helping BP out.

Bill

[little john]

most likely the drones are not Cordovan therefore the offspring would all be itialian or whatever.

Is that the way it works?  A Cordovan mixed breed would never look like a Cordovan?

To be annoyingly pedantic for a moment - it's not so much a 'mixed-breed', but a 'mixed-mating' - because Cordovan isn't a breed of honeybee - it's a colouring.  Usually (but not always) of Italians.  Bit like the insect equivalent of an albino.  Some basic info at: http://www.dave-cushman.net/bee/cordovan.html
LJ

[Acebird]

Weak broodless hives are terrible almond pollinators.
Jim

Didn't know that.

[Acebird]

because Cordovan isn't a breed of honeybee - it's a colouring.  Usually (but not always) of Italians.

So if it is a freak of nature how do breeders produce them and why do people want them?

[Van, Arkansas, USA]

Ace, in my case the Cordovan bees are just Itialian.  I need the color as a genetic marker.  Cordovans are commonly use in scientific assays due to the fact of their coloring breeds true.

The Cordovans act like any other itialian.  A freak of nature??  Don?t know I would call the bees that.  There are pigment variations in many species, wood duck: recessive color is apricot wood duck,,,,,, red birds cardinal recessive  color is yellow, with horses the gene is called a ?cream gene? palamino, pheasant: recessive variation is melanistic.

I do not believe the Cordovan color is available in Asia.  I have seen advertising for such a bee, but international transport in next to impossible.  I do believe there is a Cordovan in Aussie land.  Perhaps if Bill ELTALIA reads this thread he can comment.

However LJ is using the term albino as a good example of a recessive gene.  A good example, I almost used myself but reframed for scientific reasons.

I have tried extensive study of the Cordovan color in honey bees:  PubMed, not google, but I cannot find bonafide literature.
Blessings

[Acebird]

Isn't it difficult to breed for recessive trait?  There aren't that many yellow cardinals around.

[little john]

However LJ is using the term albino as a good example of a recessive gene.  A good example, I almost used myself but refrained for scientific reasons.

Hi Van - it was the nearest analogy I could think of ... 
Around the turn of the 20th Century, there was a fair bit of interest in 'Golden' Bees (undoubtedly Cordovan) in Britain, as Italians were very popular at around that time, and the Cordovan colour provided a very useful marker to detect when Italian-Cordovan queens had been mated to our rather unpleasant Black Bees.  One guy even wrote a book detailing the mating (and thus promoting) these Golden Bees: https://archive.org/details/cu31924003427295  But over the years interest in them seems to have waned.

If I were interested in keeping Italians, rather than Buckfast and Carniolans, then I'd certainly favour the Cordovan colouring, as it's such a useful genetic indicator.
LJ