How to boost nucs for winter

[CountryBee]

I have 4 nucs going to go thru fall and into winter. Not sure how to boost them for brood so that they will make it thru winter.  Should I feed them, or build a heater to help the queen lay more brood?  Still new to bee keeping and reading and learning as fast as  I can from you all.  Thank you so much!

[specialkayme]

So you ONLY have 4 nucs? No other hives? What is your location? How cold does your winter get, and how soon does it come? Do you know if your honey flow has come and gone already?

A few more facts and we should be able to point you in the right direction.

[CountryBee]

4 Nucs, 3 hives only 1 deep high.  I live in central NY.  The winters get pretty cold here.  Want to keep as many hives as possible to start big come spring.  I insulate with foam for winter.  Not sure how much honey a 2-5 frame nuc needs for winter.  Thanks again.

[specialkayme]

Winters are much milder where I'm at, so I'm not 100% sure about what you would need, but hopefully I can steer you in the right direction. :-P

First, might I suggest putting two nucs side by side and wrapping them up in Styrofoam. That way the heat from one hive will help out the neighbor. Kinda like a row home.

Second, if you have a 2 frame nuc by September, it isn't going to make it through the winter. Your best bet would be to combine it into another nuc/hive in August. A 5 frame nuc has a chance of making it. But my guess would be that you need three frames of bees (with good size) and two of honey. Again, not 100% on that, but I think it would work. It would be best to hear from some in your area, or attend a local beekeeping meeting to make sure though.

Back to your original questions though, I wouldn't build a heater. I can only see that going badly (but, I've never tried it). I've heard some people up your way put bees in their basements. Might be something you would consider.

However, since it is July, your best bet would be to get those nucs big before winter comes, and get them into 10 frame hives. Open them up and see if they have plenty of pollen. If so, don't feed them, but if not, give them some pollen. If you are in a nectar flow, they should be fine on that, but if your flow is over, start feeding them sugar water.

Once they fill up 4 frames, move them to a 10 frame hive. From there, keep them building up. Since it's July, you an get them built up in time to make a whole colony get through the winter, rather than worrying about a nuc making it through.

[Robo]

You want at least 4 solid frames worth of stores for winter.  Start feeding no later that Sept 1st and don't feed after Oct 1st or they won't be able to ripen it in time.

[specialkayme]

You want at least 4 solid frames worth of stores for winter.  Start feeding no later that Sept 1st and don't feed after Oct 1st or they won't be able to ripen it in time.

Four frames of stores in a five frame nuc? Or is that for a 10 frame hive?

[Hethen57]

You've got a while between now and then.  I would make up some Nuc supers and let them fill those to build up their numbers and their storage capacity.  I have read about people wintering in 5 frame nucs, but it is not ideal for the hive and not typical.  I made splits at this time last year with 4 frames of bees and they expanded to a deep and a medium with nearly constant feeding through the summer and made it though the winter just fine.

[timjea]

Hethen57 - did they expand that deep and medium from foundation, or did you give them some full/partial drawn comb?  The reason I ask is I have a few late swarm catches that have just now grown to 10 frames, and I have no mroe drawn comb to use, so every new frame I give them will be wax foundation or popsicle stick tabbed.  thats a lot of wax drawing to do by winter.

[Robo]

Four frames of stores in a five frame nuc? Or is that for a 10 frame hive?

5 frame nucs.

[specialkayme]

Four frames of stores in a five frame nuc? Or is that for a 10 frame hive?

5 frame nucs.

And they can make it through the winter with only one frame of brood? I didn't think that would work. Good to know.

[Robo]

And they can make it through the winter with only one frame of brood? I didn't think that would work. Good to know.

Depending on the weather, by late November/early December thy should have no brood.


Michael Palmer does about 500 4-frame nucs each winter in Vermont and I believe he tries for 3 1/2 of the 4 frames with stores.

[Finski]

.
It is middle summer now. Nucs have time to grow to normal hives.
It depends what you are doing now

Basic rules to nuc growing:

* room only for occupied frames
* filled food frames off and good heavens, no feeding
* warm insulated walls, no mesh floor, a small entrance =  2x 3 cm

[Finski]

4 Nucs, 3 hives only 1 deep high. 

  Not sure how much honey a 2-5 frame nuc needs for winter.  Thanks again.

3 hives only 1 deep high  = should have 2-3 occupied boxes after a month and 4-5 boxes before winter

2 frame nuc is absolutly too small. It makes only troubles.  I have 3 frame mating nucs 10-15 pieces  along the summer.

If you give a emerging brood frame from bigger hives to 2-frame nuc get 5 frame occupation and it starts to grow quite well. It will get 2 boxes before winter.

[Finski]

3 hives only 1 deep high. .

What is inside?

how many brood frames
how much occupied
how much food frames

If all frames are occupied it is better to give a bix of foundatuon under the brood store that bees can enlarge down. Still warm air stays up in brood store.'

Now it is not time to think about winter. It is much to do in  summer.
If I was you, I would join now 2 frame nucs to 4 frame nucs.'

You have enough hives to next year. And try to get them to real hives.
With small nucs you are in trouble next spring. They have only value of spare queen.

If you have  5 hives next summer, you need about  25-30 boxes and foundation frames in there.

.

.

[CountryBee]

The nucs are now 4-5 frames each. One of honey the rest of brood and pollen.  I split them because they had a queen cell on a frame.  So I thought that is easy way to make another hive.  So each nuc has queen cell and brood and honey and pollen.  I am not feeding.  Not sure if I need to do anything else.  Thanks again.

[Hethen57]

Countrybee:
Last year I gave them wax foundation, this year I am trying foundationless on my brood frames.  At the end of the summer I shifted some frames and boxes around to that every hive had at least a deep and a medium.  If I had room for any more bees, I would try those insulated boxes like Robo has for late summer splits.  Seems like everyone has to find what works for them, there are so many variables.

[FRAMEshift]

Basic rules to nuc growing:
* room only for occupied frames
* filled food frames off and good heavens, no feeding
* warm insulated walls, no mesh floor, a small entrance =  2x 3 cm

Why is it so important not to feed?  We started a nuc with a queen but no foragers, so we've been feeding 1:1 to replace some of the lost access to nectar.  Is this a mistake?  There is a flow on now, but it will end soon, so we were trying to help the nuc bees make some new wax.

[Robo]

Brushy Mountain is having a webinar on over-wintering nucs.

http://forum.beemaster.com/index.php/topic,28967.0.html

[cam]

Here's a link to wintering 2 frame nucs.
http://www.mbbeekeeping.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=48&Itemid=59

[casper_zip]

Countrybee:

Where did you get these good looking Nucs ? They look like they are made of plastic, maybe made in Germany ?

Please let me know, I like the looks of these babies.

Best,

casper_zip