Foundation less frames?

[beyondthesidewalks]

" if I decide to go foundation less do I wire?"

Here in Texas it gets very hot.  With all the sunspot and solar flare actvity this year we're expecting an extremely hot summer(it's not CO2, it is the sun).  Anyway, with deep frames full of brood and/or honey in this heat you'll have a hard time manipulating frames without having some bend and even break off.  Some may fall off the top bar while sitting in the hive if the bees cannot control the heat well enough.  With that in mind I've started running two strands of 50# test fishing line in my deep frames. You can also use frame wire.  Those two strands will support the comb until the bees attach it to the bottom and sides.  In shallow or medium frames it is not as bad because the bees have a shorter distance to cover to get the sides and bottom attached and there is not as much weight in the frame.  Your heart sinks as you watch some brood comb fall off the frame in your hand.

IMO the benefits of going foundationless far outweigh the honey cost of drawing foundationless frames.  You're only losing what would be the mid rib of the comb which is much thicker with foundation.  It is very thin with foundationless.  In that respect foundationless is much less expensive because less wax is used (that wax for the foundation came from some bees hard work and cost more honey!).  If you already have drawn comb, from foundation or foundationless, the point is moot.  I see no more brace or burr comb with foundationless frames than I saw when I used foundation, especially plastic foundation.

[FRAMEshift]

Here in Texas it gets very hot.  With all the sunspot and solar flare actvity this year we're expecting an extremely hot summer(it's not CO2, it is the sun). 

I was wondering how folks in Texas would rationalize the change in their climate.  (it's not politics, it is science.  :-D ) 

Anyway, with deep frames full of brood and/or honey in this heat you'll have a hard time manipulating frames without having some bend and even break off. 

That's true in North Carolina too.  It may help to put your hives in afternoon shade.  And don't work the hives during the hot part of the day, which is easy because a bee suit gets really hot too.  And don't let the sun shine directly on frames when you work them.  They heat up quickly.    But the fishing line is a clever idea.

[Riggs]

" I've started running two strands of 50# test fishing line in my deep frames. You can also use frame wire.  Those two strands will support the comb until the bees attach it to the bottom and sides.  In shallow or medium frames it is not as bad because the bees have a shorter distance to cover to get the sides and bottom attached and there is not as much weight in the frame.

I use all mediums with fishing line, I did use alot smaller line though. seems to work well.

[sterling]

I use 10 penny coated nails in the side holes in the medium frames. But I wire the deeps.

[beyondthesidewalks]

"(it's not politics, it is science.   )"

That's right.  The IPCC is all about politics and not much about science.  Science, even in the world of beekeeping, is all about forming a hypothesis and then collecting all of the data that supports AND doesn't support your hypothesis.  That's not what the IPCC is doing.  As revealed in their leaked email traffic, they have come to their conclusion and collect only the data that supports their conclusion, don't even acknowledge that data that refutes their conclusion and "interpret" data to bend it to support their conclusion.

This same phenomenon happens in regards to beekeepers and foundationless frames.  Those who have tried it only once, or never even tried it, want to tell us how wrong or bad it is.  They have their agenda and look only for the proof that supports their agenda, ignoring the fact that many of us are having much success with foundationless frames. 

[beyondthesidewalks]

"But the fishing line is a clever idea."

I wish that I could claim credit for it but cannot.  I originally saw a Don the Fat Beeman youtube video where he supports wax foundation by running fishing line on both sides of the foundation in the frame, using an 'X' across each face of the foundation to prevent sagging of the foundation in the frame.  Someone else (who lives in a very warm climate) in another forum that I no longer frequent communicated the idea of wiring deep frames to support the comb.  I chose to use fishing line instead of wire.  I found out later that others had been using fishing line before me.  Clever but not very original.

I'm a big believer in sharing best practices.  I really enjoy the sharing of experience and ideas to improve anything, whether it be beekeeping, my farming or my profession.

[FRAMEshift]

The IPCC is all about politics and not much about science. 

You are not correct about that, but since this is not Coffee House, I won't comment further.

[beyondthesidewalks]

Join me there.