Oak Tree / Tough Cutout...What Do You Think?

simmonds · May 17, 2012, 07:52:35 PM

Ok, this is a tough one folks. A property management company called and wants me to remove a hive from an oak tree in the backyard of a property. Not really sure if this a new swarm that arrived or if they are established. I did note that they are bringing in pollen though. The yardcare folks will not mow the property for fear of the bees living in the tree and they want them gone asap. If I cannot get them out really soon they will kill them. The entrance is about waist high on the tree and it looks like it is through an old knot hole about 3 or 4 inches wide. Not far up from the entrance the tree branches out and one large branch goes over the neighbors fence...cutting this tree down is NOT an option. They don't have time for a trapout.

Has anyone ever removed a hive from a living tree? Can this be done? They are not concerned with the tree as it is small, has lots of damage and probably will not live too many more years. I'm not sure what is worse though in this situation...damage a tree to the point that it will eventually die or kill a hive of bees? I told them we would do it and now am having second thoughts.

What ya think? :?

Kathyp · May 17, 2012, 07:57:56 PM

i don't think you have many options here. if you can't do a trap out, you can't really do a "removal" from a tree. see if they will take the tree down for you if you close up the hive a night. you can take the section home and do a trap out or removal at your convenience. the only other option is extermination, i think.

blanc · May 17, 2012, 08:30:10 PM

Hey sim!
DId one just today and what I did was use a chainsaw to cut about 8"x 12" window in the first hole to get a good look at it and was at the base of the hive. Was real careful not to cut into the hive itself and moved up the tree in diff spots as I went up. Wind up being about 8FT hive and took me all day. Used a bee vac I made and was able to get most of the little gals out. They do get very upset with you when you tear they place up and took quite a number of stings. Home owner is taking the tree out due to the internal rot and is going to sent some pics he took of me and will post asap. When I took out as much comb as I could I smoke the tar out of em to get em out of all the nooks and crannies. Tried a trap out but the entrance was in a bad spot and they kept eating through the foam insulation. Hopes this helps out.
James

Kathyp · May 17, 2012, 09:20:07 PM

that works if they are taking the tree down. once you start cutting into it, you are going to have a ticked off homeowner coming after you when it blows down later on.

i tell people that the tree is damaged anyway if there is enough of a hollow for the bees to build in. most of these trees that have a hive in the trunk probably need to come down....but people like to save their tree and their bees. :-D

nietssemaj · May 17, 2012, 09:33:17 PM

I've seen a couple video's about a smoke out. Might be an option.

Robo · May 17, 2012, 09:37:40 PM

I'm with Kathy on this one. If they aren't concerned with saving the tree (sounds like it ain't worth saving anyway) I would cut the bee section out and take it home and then worry about getting them out. If you cut it open there, you have much more exposure with liability issues.

If they aren't concerned with the tree, why can't it be cut down? If that is the case, I would advise you to walk away. Looks like a liability suit waiting to happen when the tree you hack open falls on the neighbors fence.

Smoke outs only work on new swarms.

carlfaba10t · May 17, 2012, 09:42:09 PM

Did one on a large oak tree,peice of cake if you seal the opening after sundown when all bees are in tree,then go back next morning and cut down tree,wont live much longer anyway.Cut section with hive and transport.Just look at all that fine firewood. :-D

simmonds · May 17, 2012, 10:21:25 PM

Thanks for the replies! Problem with the tree is there is a large branch going over the neighbors fence. If it wasn't for that, I would seal up the hive and fell the tree and go from there. I suppose I could ask the neighbors if they would cooperate with me going into their yard and working on removing that branch, then I could do what I want with the tree.

blanc, I would love it if you could post some pics of that job. That would be great! Part of me says walk away from this one...or run :-D, the other part of me wants to do it just for the experience. As far a PO'd bees, don't worry, I will be fully fully protected for this job...no T-shirts shorts and flip flops! :shock:

The tree isn't really that big around and I don't see how they have much room for a hive in there.

Chris

JP · May 17, 2012, 10:43:37 PM

Quote from: simmonds on May 17, 2012, 10:21:25 PM
Thanks for the replies! Problem with the tree is there is a large branch going over the neighbors fence. If it wasn't for that, I would seal up the hive and fell the tree and go from there. I suppose I could ask the neighbors if they would cooperate with me going into their yard and working on removing that branch, then I could do what I want with the tree.

blanc, I would love it if you could post some pics of that job. That would be great! Part of me says walk away from this one...or run :-D, the other part of me wants to do it just for the experience. As far a PO'd bees, don't worry, I will be fully fully protected for this job...no T-shirts shorts and flip flops! :shock:

The tree isn't really that big around and I don't see how they have much room for a hive in there.

Chris

Have the experience on another tree. From reading your posts I would say you should run away from this one. You will get your chance on another tree.

...JP

BlueBee · May 18, 2012, 01:51:18 AM

Sounds like way too much work to me. Once you have your own bees and get good at it, you will have WAY more bees than you know what to do with, so bees that are hard to extract just don't interest me; especially when the job pays $0 and consumes a lot of your time. Getting feral genetics IS valuable, but still not worth it in this case IMO. Always a lot simpler to catch a swarm from a tree to get the genetics rather than deal with thousands of pounds of wood.

Listen to meatloaf and fly like a bat

blanc · May 18, 2012, 09:03:33 AM

The tree I worked on was pretty sizable and home owner is taking it down this weekend and they way I cut it did not compromise the integrity of the tree too much. Is 1 ft thick to rotten core plus the home owner had his own tree cutting service one time and felt real comfortable doing it because other wise I would not been able to get to the bees. Too big to put back the truck to get home. :-D

simmonds · May 21, 2012, 10:40:20 PM

Well folks, against my better judgement (and many of yours :-D), Julie and I tackled the tree hive on Friday afternoon. Lots of honey, lots of brood and a TON of bees...over 5 pounds! The tree has seen better days now, although I think it could actually live another 100 years even with the chain saw windows we cut into it. There were neighbor college girls that let us plug in our extension cord and they came over and had a great time looking into the hive at all the bees and the impressive comb...one even stated she is really excited and is now considering being a beek herself! The bees are doing great in their new hive in the garden doing lots house cleaning and dragging out lots of tree debris and saw dust. There were enough bees that I started with two deeps and built a inspection window into the top deep. They seem to love the new home. I will get some pictures up soon of the cutout. We didn't get many though as our hands were just too sticky with honey and the lighting was bad. We started at around 5:30 pm and got done around 9:00.

On top of that we got a call yesterday for a sweet little swarm in a tree in Springfield just over head height. It was small but they now are living in a nuc box and doing fine too! :) Out of wood ware now so I guess its time to build.

Chris

simmonds · May 24, 2012, 08:15:17 PM

The tree hive from Alder street seems to be doing good in their new home. Terrible weather hit and lasted a few days after we hived them so they were finally able to exit the hive and relieve themselves yesterday and made quite a spotty mess on the hive boxes. :shock:

All I have on my phone is this picture we took after the initial cut after vac of the bees off the comb.

Here is a video I posted on YouTube of them in their new home:

Alder Street Hive

BlueBee · May 25, 2012, 01:56:19 AM

Looks like a healthy hive to me. Good job.

I love that observation window in your hive box!

Now the question is.....did you get the queen?

Riggs · May 25, 2012, 10:02:52 AM

I love the observation window too, in fact just built a deep with almost the whole end covered in plexiglass. I hinged a 1/4" piece of plywood to keep it covered unless I want to look in. Was going to put it on this weekend.

Glad the cut out is doing well.

Robo · May 25, 2012, 10:14:39 AM

I know everyone is excited about having a observation window to look inside, but be forewarned, a view of the end bars gets unexciting very quickly. You can learn more of what is going on in the hive by observing the entrance than you can by looking at the end bars.

Riggs · May 25, 2012, 10:38:00 AM

Quote from: Robo on May 25, 2012, 10:14:39 AM
I know everyone is excited about having a observation window to look inside, but be forewarned, a view of the end bars gets unexciting very quickly. You can learn more of what is going on in the hive by observing the entrance than you can by looking at the end bars.

Dang Robo, don't kill my buzz before I even get it on :-D

I just had a piece laying around and couldn't resist. I figure they will cover it pretty quick anyway. Thought it might add a different perspective to a rookie like myself.

simmonds · May 25, 2012, 01:53:33 PM

Quote from: Riggs on May 25, 2012, 10:38:00 AM
Quote from: Robo on May 25, 2012, 10:14:39 AM
I know everyone is excited about having a observation window to look inside, but be forewarned, a view of the end bars gets unexciting very quickly. You can learn more of what is going on in the hive by observing the entrance than you can by looking at the end bars.

Dang Robo, don't kill my buzz before I even get it on :-D

I just had a piece laying around and couldn't resist. I figure they will cover it pretty quick anyway. Thought it might add a different perspective to a rookie like myself.

I know, I understand the view from the end bars will get old quickly. I didn't have a deep and just built this one up in a hurry while Julie was making frames/foundations and happened to have a piece of plexiglass handy. I should probably hinge a piece of plywood to cover the plexi too...any downsides to having the large window not covered?

Robo · May 25, 2012, 02:05:24 PM

Quote from: simmonds on May 25, 2012, 01:53:33 PM
...any downsides to having the large window not covered?

Just direct sunlight and greenhouse effect.

If you don't cover it from the outside to keep light out, the bees will most likely propolize it from the inside to block the light (they like it dark), making the view not to good :-)