Advice please

[PhilK]

...at least with more boxes to observe & interact with we can get more experience without having to worry we're excessively disrupting the microbial ecosystem :)

The bacteria? They should be fine! 

[folieadeux]

Thank you to everyone who has responded. It is humbling to receive so much input from so many knowledgable people. Thank you sincerely for your time & your interest.
Thank you especially to iddee who saved me from this disaster!
"NO, NO. NO.
In 3 days they will forget each other and the queen will be killed, unless done carefully as a "combine"."

So on Sunday we decided it was time to get in & have a good look at what was going on in the 8 frame, 3 deep box that houses the swarm bees. 
(Just for the record - I found this swarm on the 17/10/2015, & they went into the used 8 frame box (with 8 stickies) that same evening.)
We used smoke this time ... probably too much smoke ... will try & relax more & find a better balance next time.
We got into all 3 boxes & when we got into the bottom box we found that there are in fact six plastic frames. We took out the one nearest the wall on each side & moved all the other frames out one space, placing 2 new frames with starter strips in the middle of the box. (I hope we followed that correctly  iddee?)
To my surprises, (aside from the fact there were plastic frames in there & I have a personal prejudice against plastic) everything looked really clean & healthy. The suspicious looking dark sticky combs I remember reluctantly putting in the box at the start were nowhere to be seen - the bees seem to have cleaned & revamped everything :)
There were a lot of bees ... bees absolutely everywhere! So many bees in fact that it made it hard to see as much as we would have liked to have seen. What we could see looked pretty good, &, importantly, we didn't see any signs of disease (at least nothing we could identify from the photos in the books we have.)
I want to write that there seemed to be a lot of drones in there - but then I wondered "Compared to what?" Given I haven't a clue how many drones there should be in a hive, I guess I just assumed from what I'd read that there wouldn't be a lot & that they almost all would be out hanging around a bee pick-up joint anyway.

Having got box number 1 back together without major mishap, we decided to have a look in box number 2 while we had the gear on. Box number 2 is the package we bought 24/10/2015. They were as quiet as usual, & we didn't have any trouble checking through the two ten frame full depth boxes. These little guys also seem to be doing well & there were no signs of disease that we could see. Not as many bees obviously, but they are getting on the front foot & building up strength & numbers I think.

After checking through the hives & doing a lot more reading here I'm a little depressed at just how much there is to know about bees & beekeeping & all the related subjects. However everyone had to start at the beginning one time, so I guess we'll just keep putting one foot in front of the other until we reach the day when we'll laugh at how little we knew when we started out, & even the trickier aspects will be as easy as falling off a log for us :)
Thank you again for all the helpful input you've given us so far :)

[iddee]

Sounds like you did quite well. Was only the bottom box packed with bees, or all three boxes? If all three, it's time to add a fourth. When using starter strips, keep all frames tightly against each other. No space in between.
You get an A for that test. Now on to the next semester. 

If the bees have free reign, there will be about 17% drones. That's nearly one in five bees, at the height of the season. Fewer at other times.

PS. There's not so much to learn. I've only been at it for forty years, and I already know almost 10% of it.      

[folieadeux]

Hi iddee :)

All 3 boxes had a lot of bees.

The third box had fully drawn comb with a little room for honey still. We don't have another 8 frame box - it will take a trip to the city to buy one. We bought several boxes in flat pack & have them ready for bees, but we bought all 10 frame full depth, because we thought we wanted to go that way (my math isn't great, but I can multiply by 10 :) And that's the truth of why I chose 10 frame :) ) However now we've read so many people saying they prefer 8 frame, & supers or ideals at that, we're wondering if we made a mistake there :/

"You get an A for that test."
Thank you for the A :) :) :)

PS. There's not so much to learn. I've only been at it for forty years, and I already know almost 10% of it.    

Get out with you! :)
We just happened to come across a video of you here on the forum (the "Swarm in a building vent" thread) & were tickled pink to be able to put a face to the name :)   I was just about speechless to realise what illustrious company we are keeping here on the bee forum! :)

[little john]

After checking through the hives & doing a lot more reading here I'm a little depressed at just how much there is to know about bees & beekeeping & all the related subjects.

Understandable, but try not to get too depressed at the prospect of (what appears to be) a vertical learning curve. Just bear in mind that the bees have been at this game a lot longer than humans have. Humans have only become essential in the lives of bees in two ways: one is to provide weatherproof cavities for them, and the other is to provide food for them in times of dearth.

If humans didn't exist, then the numbers of colonies would reduce to that of the number of natural cavities and the amount of seasonal food available. But we do exist, and have increased bee colony numbers to way beyond what nature would normally support. Hence our obligation to now provide shelter for them, and be ready to feed if conditions should warrant that.

Other than those considerations - what bees really enjoy most of all is to be left alone in peace. In practice, that tends not to happen (especially with beginners, who are naturally curious) too often, but fortunately bees are - in the main - fairly tolerant of us poking around inside their homes.

FWIW - I also share your dislike of plastic 'anything' inside a hive. I'm currently trialling heavy-gauge polythene sheeting as crown boards (top covers), but my view is that all structures actually inside the cavity belong to the bees, and not me. I'm just an occasional visitor there.

'best, LJ

[iddee]

Box size is all personal preference. I am 70 years old and still prefer 10 frame equip. Deeps for brood and mediums "6 5/8 in." for honey. They have been the norm for well over 100 years, and with good reason. Recently, people have gotten so lazy, suppliers capitalize on it and promote smaller boxes.

[chux]

You guys are doing great!!! Don't be discouraged. One tiny suggestion. When you added those two foundationless frames in the middle of the bottom box, it may have been better to put a drawn frame between them. More than likely, they will draw out those two frames straight, but there is the chance that they will view that wide open space as an invitation to draw cross-comb. Especially at the outside ends of the frame. I find that there is a higher chance of nice straight combs in my foundationless frames when I put a drawn frame on either side. Just a thought. Others with more experience may disagree with good reason. And, as I said, they will probably draw it out straight anyway. If I were you, I wouldn't go back in to change it. 

[yantabulla]

I agree Chux

[Michael Bush]

If you put an empty frame in the brood nest between two straight brood combs they will draw a perfect comb between.  If you put an empty frame in the honey super between two drawn but uncapped combs, they will draw those combs fatter.

[folieadeux]

little john, iddee, chux, yantabulla, Michael, PhilK, Lancej, JackM & GSF - thank you for reading & responding. And than you all for the encouragement :)

Suffice for now to say that all the bees survived the hive opening on Sunday & the girls from the hive with attitude are still P.O'd at us - the washing is hanging on the balcony again today because no-one is allowed in the back yard yet :) Still ... to be fair ... I read a lot of threads after I posted the original & I am going to reduce my estimation of them from "hot hot hot" down to "hot". Yes, they are a bit territorial, & yes they hold a grudge for a few days, but I read quite a few stories of bees that are much worse than our gals. When we can move them to a position further away from the house I think they will be good as gold. In the interests of biodiversity & a wide gene pool I reckon I'll just give them a bit of space :)

We're just about to pop another box on top of the 10 frame hive housing the quiet ladies as per iddee's advice. Fingers crossed it's just a 5 minute job :) And tomorrow we're going to the bee shop to buy a couple more 8 frame boxes so the number 1 hive can get a bit more elbow room too :)

[Wombat2]

I see you are from Australia - if you put at least your State and maybe home town in it will help with location specific questions.  ( big difference in handling bees in FNQ and Tassie)  Also please register with your local Ag Dept. It keeps you legal and helps them know where hives are located in case of problems in your area. - and the little it costs goes toward bio-security and keeping varroa out of the country.

[chux]

If you put an empty frame in the brood nest between two straight brood combs they will draw a perfect comb between.  If you put an empty frame in the honey super between two drawn but uncapped combs, they will draw those combs fatter.

Yep!!! I made that mistake this year in the honey-supers. I loved those massively thick combs of honey, but didn't get the other frames drawn out.

[folieadeux]

"I see you are from Australia - if you put at least your State and maybe home town in it will help with location specific questions.  ( big difference in handling bees in FNQ and Tassie)"

Thanks for the tip Wombat2 :)
I've updated to show 2 locations - which is still a bit confusing unfortunately :/
At the moment we're located in the Southern Highlands - we're working here. When the weather is good here it's pretty much perfect. But unfortunately that leaves the other 360 days of the year when it is less than perfect ;) :/ And in winter, it's down right horrid. I might be prejudiced - I'm a Queenslander & I really don't like the cold. I also detest wind. Which pretty much leaves me grumpy most of the year :)
We have 2 hives here - one a swarm I found in a wind-swept cemetery overlooking the coastline, one a package we bought from Hornsby Beekeeping Supplies in Sydney (it came from Warren & Rose Taylor out at Blayney).
Home for us is in the hills behind the Mid North Coast.  We're hopeful of getting home & staying at the end of June. We tried to buy a few nucs to grow into 10 frame hives out there over summer, but for one reason or another we came up empty handed. Many beekeepers seem to have had adverse conditions one way or another over the past couple of years & now it's probably too late for this season. We will take home the 2 lots of bees we have here when we go, but given my unease about the used equipment I'd like to keep them well seperate from any new bees/equipment we purchase for 12 months. Call me paranoid - I'd rather that than be very sorry if anything was amiss.
The two climates are worlds apart. Here in the Southern Highlands the weather is quite mild, very low humidity, lots of wind, many overcast days & it snows one or 2 days during winter. One big positive is that there are no SHB's here! :)
At home on the Mid North Coast we get quite a lot of hot days over summer, high rainfall, the humidity is high, wind is not a problem & the extent of the cold is a few good frosts a year. Unfortunately the Mid North Coast is known for being ideal for SHB :(
I have no idea if there are SHB actually at our place. It's an hour inland, altitude 287m, no domestic european bees in the immediate area (there are a few ferals around - not many).  They are certainly present on the coast. Am I correct in understanding that even if there are no SHB's there now that once we bring bees there they will arrive pretty soon after? How far can they fly, & from how far away can they detect hives?

"Also please register with your local Ag Dept. It keeps you legal and helps them know where hives are located in case of problems in your area. - and the little it costs goes toward bio-security and keeping varroa out of the country."
We were as please as kindergarten kids getting a gold star yesterday when we received our official licence number & hive brand :) :) :) 

[PhilK]

... They are certainly present on the coast. Am I correct in understanding that even if there are no SHB's there now that once we bring bees there they will arrive pretty soon after? How far can they fly, & from how far away can they detect hives?

They can fly pretty far - this website says about 5km but possibly further.

https://www.daf.qld.gov.au/plants/weeds-pest-animals-ants/pest-animals/a-z-listing-of-pest-animals/photo-guide-to-pest-animals/small-hive-beetle

[folieadeux]

Thank you for the link PhilK :)
Checking it out now  ...