Starting a New Hive

[CliveHive]

Starting a new hive - -

Say I have an old  trailer full of nice bees, who have been there through a couple of seasons, expanded  and remain well-behaved.  Nobody has tried to rip their home apart, so there is no reason for them to be ugly - - but so far - - nice bees.  If I want to leave them right where they are, and use them to source new colonies, is there something basically wrong with that? 

If I want to do that, how do I go about it?  I thought about swarm traps and lures. nuc boxes and honey comb - - - and then I opened the back of my suv that had a new 10-frame hive in the back, with waxed-foundations in it, (about 150 ft from the bee trailer) and a scout came along to see what it was all about. 
She had a good, long look - -  didn't go in, but landed on the landing board.  So then I thought - - this colony is Huge!  They could populate that hive in 5 minutes, if they were in the mood.  Why should I screw around with swarm traps? 
So I put the new hive in the trailer to see what would happen.  If I see drawn-out comb in 10 days or so, I will be happy - - and surprised - - - if I see brood, I will be ecstatic - - - If I see nothing (what I expect) - - - what should I do next?  Stick a swarm lure in the box? 

We are in the middle of an area where, in about 2-3 weeks about 50 square mile of cotton will come into bloom, so we are a bit behind the curve here  - - - but - - - the trailer bees will load-up - - - just looking for a way to make their honey accessible, without destroying the original colony. 

Bee Gurus - - Guidance, please - - - .

[iddee]

Set up a trapout cone and take about 8 frames of bees. Let them raise a queen. It will leave the trailer hive strong enough to build back up. Do it once each year.

http://www.beemaster.com/forum/index.php?topic=20301.0

[CliveHive]

Thanks, IDDEE

Took me a while to figure out the concept of a trapout cone and how it works - - pretty cool! 
My trailer bees are behind panels and in the ceiling, which they enter and exit through many, many points, so it doesn't look like a trapout will work for me. 

A frame of wet brood from another hive to attract nurse bees to the new hive? - - Yes, I can do that.  The final spot for the new hive is about a mile and a half from the trailer, so I'm thinking my steps are: 

1.  Use wet brood to attract trailer bees to a new hive.
2.  When I have about 5 frames of bees, and they have capped the wet brood, move the hive 3 miles away, and let them grow a queen. (or introduce an entirely new queen)
3.  When I know the queen is happy, accepted, and producing brood, move the whole shooting-match to the new site. 

2 moves and lots of work, but it looks like it should work?  Am I missing something?  Is there an easier way?   

[KeyLargoBees]

no......they will go back to the hive they are familiar with....open brood isn't enough to lure them to stay and not go home. The idea of a trapout is to in essence make them homeless with no place to go ...then they choose the brood.

[iddee]

1... Nurse bees don't leave the hive.

2... Flying bees will just remove the honey from the frame and carry it home. You could maybe cover the trailer with a tarp or something to the point there is no entrance, then make a small hole and install the cone.

[CliveHive]

OK.  Im getting it.  This is more difficult than I thought - - -

Big trailer.  I would not know how to seal it - - -

Next thought - - -

I could move the new hive right next to the wall/panel in the trailer, drill a 1" hole in the hive and the panel, connect them with 1" conduit, so the nurses and staff
could walk into the new hive. 

How about that?

[iddee]

Before I tried that, I would get a bee vac, remove the panel, vac the bees I wanted, then replace the panel.   

I have read that you can put an extracted super above the inner lid on a hive and the bees will clean the remaining honey out of it, but won't refill it through the hole in the inner lid. I doubt they would expand the hive through a one inch hole, but have never tried it.

[CliveHive]

OK.  I know where to get a bee vac.  I'm pretty sure I will have more than enough bees when the panel comes off - - -
Then what?  take some brood and honey comb from the feral hive, and rubber band it to frames in the new hive? 
Pour in the bees, strap the hive, then move them three or four miles away, and wait for them to produce a queen? 
Move them three or four miles away, and put a bought queen in the hive with them? 

[iddee]

The first, if you want their genetics. The second if you want to buy a certain strain of bee.

Or put a frame of eggs and open larva into the box from your favorite hive.

Just depends on what breed of queen you want. All 3 will work.

[CliveHive]

Thanks IDDEE.  I will meet 30 or 40 local beekeepers on Thursday.  I think I will see if I can beg a frame of local, well-behaved brood from one of them. 
If I do that, and the hive is queenless, will the bees know that one of those larvae/eggs has to be turned into a queen?  will they build a queen cell for her?

[iddee]

Yes, as long as there are eggs. They will choose a few eggs/larva, as they hatch, and make queen cells. Keep it as warm as possible while transporting. The closer to 95 F., the better. If cooler, they will wait for eggs to hatch. The larva may chill during the ride, but 60 F. for a short time won't harm the eggs.

[CliveHive]

Haha!  Thanks again, iddee.  Not likely to see 60 around here until November - - maybe!
That sounds like a good direction.  I'll see how I do with my begging-bowl on Thursday - - -

[iddee]

Take a 20 dollar bill with you. That's what it takes around here for a frame of brood.

[CliveHive]

Thanks again!