Swarming benefits for varroa control in untreated beekeeping

[Vicken]

I do have lots of swarm every year and in Autumn times they really show great build up, is it because they are new laying queens or because they still have in control the Varroa population ? Does swarming affect on varroa number control?


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[bwallace23350]

Good question.

[Rurification]

This year I had several swarms and was able to catch most of them.   They turned out to be the best [most robust, built up and stayed strong] bees I've ever had.  So, I've already been thinking a lot about your original question. 

Swarming disrupts the brood cycle of the queen.   That alone is a good way to combat varroa in the short term.   If the hive swarms again next year, then the brood cycle is again disrupted for both the original queen as she moves the colony to a new home, and for the remaining colony with the virgin queen during the time she mates and begins laying.   

On the surface, it seems that swarming would have a tremendous effect on varroa control.   But I haven't been at this successfully for long enough to say more.   

[Michael Bush]

> Does swarming affect on varroa number control?

Any brood break does.  Swarming causes a brood break.

[AR Beekeeper]

The information I read was that a swarm would take away up to 45% of the colony's phoretic varroa mites.  This is probably how untreated hives manage to reduce their mite populations each spring, by mite reduction and brood break.

[Vicken]

What do you mean by phoretic

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[bwallace23350]

So in a way swarms are not always a bad thing

[Dallasbeek]

What do you mean by phoretic

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n.
An association between two species in which one transports the other, for example when a mite attaches to a beetle and is carried to a new food source.

[Vicken]

Nice info thanks brother

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[GSF]

I do have lots of swarm every year and in Autumn times they really show great build up, is it because they are new laying queens or because they still have in control the Varroa population?

Swarms by nature are some comb drawing, colony building machines. I had several of my swarms draw out and fill up an 8 frame medium box in about 10 days.

[Rurification]

So in a way swarms are not always a bad thing

I think I know where you're coming from here...   I often hear/read about how to prevent swarming... as if swarming is always a bad thing.    I think swarming is bad only if you see it as a loss, in that it weakens a hive and takes away honey producers, or as a lost hive.   This year for the first time I started looking at swarming as not only a way to increase the species, but as a way to maintain optimum health for the species.

[Acebird]

So in a way swarms are not always a bad thing

If they are not created by the beekeeper they are.  The beekeeper will either lose bees or resources.  If the beekeeper creates the swarm he/she will gain in bees and resources.  Split before they swarm and reap all the benefits of a swarm.

[Rurification]

Split before they swarm and reap all the benefits of a swarm.

I've been thinking a lot about that.   With splits, the brood cycle of the original queen is not disrupted as it would be if she swarmed.   Right?   [At least the way I've done splits....]

[Vicken]

What do u mean by queen's brood cycle is not disrupted

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[GSF]

What do u mean by queen's brood cycle is not disrupted 

When a mated queen leaves with a swarm she has to slim down first. She does then by reducing or stopping the eggs she's laying. Then it'll take a few days before she starts to laying again.

[Vicken]

But i have noticed that when the mother queen swarm then in the new hive she builds up in a better brood pattern, as if it was newly mated,  I don't think she will do better in the split ,that's my long years notice .

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[CrazyTalk]

Split before they swarm and reap all the benefits of a swarm.

I've been thinking a lot about that.   With splits, the brood cycle of the original queen is not disrupted as it would be if she swarmed.   Right?   [At least the way I've done splits....]

I'd think you're correct with a typical walkaway split - where the queenless hive gets a brood break as it raises a queen, but the other hive just keeps on going.

Seems to me this might be a point in favor of the shaken swarm type split - where the queen has to wait for the workers to build comb before she can lay. I would guess in this situation you'd have a high incidence of the queens being superseded too - which is going to lead to a another small break.

[Acebird]

I'd think you're correct with a typical walkaway split - where the queenless hive gets a brood break as it raises a queen, but the other hive just keeps on going.

Taking half the resources away slows the original queen down.  Doing it again a week or two later could cause the colony to think about supercedure.  I don't think a queen lays to potential until the colony grows to a solid two deeps of bees.  Maybe I am wrong but I don't think so.