My New Bee Shed Build

[beepro]

This winter I placed 100-watt ceramic black light under each nuc hive inside an empty nuc box.   On top box is
the active hive.  So after this shed is finish you can do the same for the 12 hives.   No need to actively heat up
the entire shed during whole winter.   Over here electric is expensive.   

[Acebird]

How do you control the environment of each hive with a light bulb?  One day of over temp and you got a big problem.  Cost of controlling 12 hives vs. 1 shed is 12:1.

[Bush_84]

This winter I placed 100-watt ceramic black light under each nuc hive inside an empty nuc box.   On top box is
the active hive.  So after this shed is finish you can do the same for the 12 hives.   No need to actively heat up
the entire shed during whole winter.   Over here electric is expensive.

While I?m not sure what part of California you are from....is any sort of heat necessary in any part of California?  Before I started keeping bees indoors I tried all sorts of tricks. I even tried the lightbulb thing. I tried some heat tape. I used tar paper. I completely encased hives in that rigid foam board stuff. I came to realize a few things. First off bees won?t heat their hive. They heat their cluster. You also have zero control when you are trying to heat an individual hive. If you are going to try to add heat to a hive you need to heat the space around them.

I am not certain that heating a shed with lights is safe or energy efficient.  The shed needs to be completely dark. So even if you miss a little crack in the bulb cover it could spell bad news. A light bulb may also not be nearly enough heat during those miserable -20 to -30 degree nights. Temperature needs to be pretty tightly controlled.

My goal is to ultimately have my hives heat the space they are in as the commercial operators do. The picture was of some empty equipment that I put in my new wintering room. If I can pack this many hives in the space the heater won?t have to run much.

[Acebird]

Ca goes from desert to glacier.  Beepro lives closer to the desert.

[cao]

>If I can pack this many hives in the space the heater won?t have to run much.

Hopefully you wll reach that level soon.  Your shed is looking good so far.   

[Bush_84]

Shed related question. In my current setup I can open the doors and allow my bees a cleansing flight. I have not stressed so much about that. However I want to try to stimulate my hives this spring. You can?t feed syrup or pollen patties without cleansing flights. So what I am thinking about doing is feeding with an inverted jar and pollen patty. We have gotten a few nice days in the 30s with some warm sun. I can face my hives out towards the door, open the door during the day, and shut it at night. Is there any reason this can?t work?  How often do you think I?ll need to open the doors?

The nice thing is that the heater in the shed will make it easier for the bees to take down syrup.

[Acebird]

I don't think they can take syrup if it is in the 40's and I wouldn't let them out if it is less than 45.  If the shed is insulated it will be colder inside on a warm day then the outside temp.  So they might stay inside unless you intentionally heated the shed up.  Then the question becomes how do you get them back inside and closed up.   I would not want to experiment with all my hives and find out it is the wrong thing to do.

[Bush_84]

I don't think they can take syrup if it is in the 40's and I wouldn't let them out if it is less than 45.  If the shed is insulated it will be colder inside on a warm day then the outside temp.  So they might stay inside unless you intentionally heated the shed up.  Then the question becomes how do you get them back inside and closed up.   I would not want to experiment with all my hives and find out it is the wrong thing to do.

Experimenting and doing the wrong thing is my biggest fear. I was planning on using night as a way to corral them back in.

[Acebird]

It could work out.  But if you heated the shed up hopefully it will be cool enough at night to keep them in.  BTW your shed should not have any glass showing or it will trap bees.

[beepro]

According to my research, our location is a semi-desert like condition in our micro-climate.  Sometimes flooding in one year and sometimes no rains for 5 consecutive years. Been there before!

To control the hive temp, I have a series of ceramic bulbs individually connected on a power strip into each hive with a temp controller.  It is not that hard to modify for this multiple hives set up. The low side on the controller is set at 80F and high at 85F.  The bulb is inside the bottom empty nuc box with a sensor.  So heat just flow upward into the colony of bees with a 1/4" solid cardboard divider inbetween them. The colony temp is around 60F enough for the bees to become active at night when the outside temp is in the mid-30s.  At this temp it is frosty outside at night.  At 40-50F the bees became inactive inside (at night) meaning that they don't feed on the syrup anymore.  So the ideal hive temp is around 60-80F in order for them to continue feeding.  Got all these figured out from my little tests to see how a colony react in a low and high temp environment. 

When the colony is pack with bees there is no need to regulate the hive temp with the light bulb.  I don't need to because they don't require it.  In this test I just want to see how a colony would grow or decline because temperature will have an affect on them.  Now I see it through the hive expansion and contraction phases.  Applying extra heat during the winter is very different from the Spring. 

In your case, I would have multiple pvc tubes extending from the hives to the outside.  This way you don't have to mess with opening and shutting the door.  It gets tiresome after a while.  On you tube there is a vid about using pvc tubes to connect to the outside environment.   All you need to do now is to heat up the individual hive with black ceramic bulb and a temp controller with 2 power strips to connect them all.   

[little john]

Experimenting and doing the wrong thing is my biggest fear. I was planning on using night as a way to corral them back in.

If it were me, I'd make holes in one wall, and connect pvc tubes ( 2-4" dia) from each hive to it's corresponding hole.  Then, cover each hole on the outside with a 'gun-port' (heavy duty cat-flap) hinged at it's top.  If you leave a few inches between box and wall, this space can then be filled with insulation.

Then, on warm days, simply open the flap widely.  If rain is a possibility, or if you're not sure about the warmth of the day - then swing open the ports to leave just an inch gap at their bottoms.

With regard to heating, I've never EVER understood the enthusiasm shown for light bulbs by the beekeeping community, when there are far more robust solutions available - such as heating tape and similar.  For anyone wanting to heat individual hives there are small silicone heating mats (12V, 10W) available on Ebay, but I much prefer to make my own heater plates from aluminium-clad resistors bonded onto small sheets of aluminium:



When using 25W resistors (the cheapest size) I match resistance with the voltage available (never more than 24V) to give an output of around 15 Watts.  This is then controlled at somewhere around 50% (nominal).  In practice I find that 7.5 Watts is more than enough, but it's always nice to have a few watts in reserve, just in case it should get very cold.  The cost of making and controlling heaters for individual hives is insignificant - certainly no more than $10 a hive.

I've made them, bench-tested them, and even installed them ... and then I removed them as being an unnecessary precaution, as over several years they never got used - not even once - and so they've been collecting dust in the shed ever since.  And right now I'm kicking myself for not having these heaters in place.  A perfect example of Sod's Law in action.
LJ

[Acebird]

If it were me, I'd make holes in one wall, and connect pvc tubes ( 2-4" dia) from each hive to it's corresponding hole.  Then, cover each hole on the outside with a 'gun-port' (heavy duty cat-flap) hinged at it's top.  If you leave a few inches between box and wall, this space can then be filled with insulation.

If you close off the only entrance to a hive how does it ventilate?  Our club loses the OB hive every year because IMO even when the tube is open the hive gets very little ventilation.  They have gone to cutting holes in the hive and screening them over.  It helped but they still lose hives.  In the case of our OB hive the bees are active because room temperature is 72 and they can't go outside in sub freezing weather.
Heat tape used to melt ice dams of the edge of a roof runs for $80 - 150 range and has no control at all.  It is one thing to supplement heat.  It is another to maintain 40 degrees when ambient swings on a daily basis to temperatures that reach -30.  I would not do as you suggest in his climate.  I would look at those that have succeeded in his climate conditions and try to imitate on the cheap.

[little john]

Brian - I'm assuming you've heard of Open Mesh Floors.  Bags of ventilation.  Inside a controlled environment they should work rather well. 

I'm not sure why you're preoccupied with heating tape, as nowhere have I suggested that the OP uses this in his shed.  What I said was that there are more robust solutions to heating - such as heating tape - than the use of light bulbs.  But that was a general comment - not directed at anything or anybody in particular.

I went on to describe two methods of heating individual hives - which is my own preferred method.  You implied earlier that this is an expensive solution - but it really isn't.  I've done it, I've proved this - and with a lot more hives than the OP.  It's only a great pity that I don't have those heaters in place at this moment, as they're sorely needed right now.  But that is my management error, not a technical or design error. 

However, heating each hive individually is a very different strategy from creating an overall controlled-environment for multiple hives - in which I maintain that the use of 'gun-ports' would be a lot more predictable in their operation than opening shed doors and hoping that the bees find their way back afterwards.  This is the only suggestion I've made in regard of the OP's Bee Shed - but as you're of the opinion that this isn't a very good idea, I await to hear your own solution to this logistical problem of providing access to the outside on warm, sunny days.
LJ

[Bush_84]

I wouldnt normally worry about it, but I want to try to maximize my hives. I had heater troubles during our coldest part of the winter and lost a lot of hives. I?m down to 2 out of 11. So I?m trying to boost what I have left. One thing to keep in mind with my current setup is that the doors are double doors that open directly to the outside. I can face my two remaining hives to the door and simply open the door. They will be directly exposed without having to find their way back into a specific spot in the shed.

[Bush_84]

Picture of my current setup. With this shed I can easily have three hives facing the door and not get to concerned about them making it back. I just put them close to the door facing out.

[Van, Arkansas, USA]

Bush, nice shed for the bees.  You work hard for the bees, well done.  I like the cat and the snow.
Blessings

[Bush_84]

Bush, nice shed for the bees.  You work hard for the bees, well done.  I like the cat and the snow.
Blessings

Thanks for the compliment but that?s the hunk of junk I?m replacing. It doesn?t have electric so I?m running an extension cord out to it, which is neither reliable nor safe. As you can see it was in need of paint when I moved in nearly 4 years ago. It has a hold in the wall, which I conveniently used as a ventilation port lol. It also had a huge tree limb fall on it just before we moved in. That was patched but never fully repaired. The shingles also needed to be redone when I moved in.

Honestly I wish I would have done my current build initially. It was one of those things that has been right in front of my face the entire time but I never saw. I am certain that I would have more than two hives right now had this new wintering room been in service last fall.

[eltalia]

Bush, nice shed for the bees.  You work hard for the bees, well done.  I like the cat and the snow.
Blessings

/nods
Yeh, looks great to me also. I'll have to go back to read why it 'failed'.
Nice looking pu55y. great to give scale to the shed ;-)))

Bill

(edited) ..carnt believe ol'Ginger there won me a "bleep" in the
post!...heh heh

[Acebird]

I went on to describe two methods of heating individual hives - which is my own preferred method.  You implied earlier that this is an expensive solution - but it really isn't.  I've done it, I've proved this - and with a lot more hives than the OP.  It's only a great pity that I don't have those heaters in place at this moment, as they're sorely needed right now.  But that is my management error, not a technical or design error. 

But John you are not dealing with -30 degrees for weeks or months.  That changes everything.  If you provide a single source heating device, blanket, light bulb, heat tape, to each hive in a seriously cold environment the bees will cluster toward that heating device consume their stores around them and then starve.  That is why if you intend to provide a man made environment for the hive it must be a controlled temperature around the whole hive and not just provide a simple heat source.
I really can't improve upon what Bush84 plans to do other than what I talked about already for letting the bees out on a warm day.  All I can say is that I have witnessed warm mornings with sun after very cold nights and the bees don't go out for hours (like until noon).  I think this happens because the honey is frozen and inside the hive is not very warm until hours of warm temperatures have made it so.  They don't break cluster, they don't know it is warm outside.  Of course when it happens it happens and it become a poop shower.
My thought was that bush84 may have to raise the temperature in the shed some time prior to letting them out and then I don't know what will happen about getting them back in.  I am thinking the first time he tries it he better not get involved in something else and forget the time.  I am thinking when the sun goes down the temperature will drop like a rock.  But maybe the timing isn't so critical.  I just don't know.

[little john]

I went on to describe two methods of heating individual hives - which is my own preferred method.  You implied earlier that this is an expensive solution - but it really isn't.  I've done it, I've proved this - and with a lot more hives than the OP.  It's only a great pity that I don't have those heaters in place at this moment, as they're sorely needed right now.  But that is my management error, not a technical or design error. 

But John you are not dealing with -30 degrees for weeks or months.  That changes everything.

Which is precisely why in the truncated quote you've given above I went on to say:
"However, heating each hive individually is a very different strategy from creating an overall controlled-environment for multiple hives - in which ..."
LJ