Splitting a queenless hive after swarm

cnewley · May 22, 2019, 09:34:06 PM

I received a 5 frame Nuc 17 days ago. I transferred it into and 8 frame hive. The Nuc was bursting at the seams and had a few empty queen cups, but I didn?t have the knowledge or equipment to immediately do a split.

I tried my best to keep them from swarming but today on day 17 they left and landed about 45 ft up a tree so I can?t get them. I did order equipment for this eventuality though so I now have enough to set up two hives. Also, I have an order in for a new queen that will arrive next Tuesday unless I cancel it.

My question is: should I set up the second hive and introduce this new queen into a new hive using half of the bees left in the original hive? If I just transfer over a few frames of honey/no brood and leave all the brood frames in the original hive can I allow them to make their own queen and rely on the new hive to accept the queen and get going?

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Donovan J · May 22, 2019, 11:56:35 PM

I recommend not putting bees from the old hive into the new one because when a hive swarms it takes half of the bees with it so the hive is now weakened. Wait until they build up and then you can shake bees in.

Donovan J · May 23, 2019, 12:09:27 AM

Also welcome fellow Washingtonian!

cao · May 23, 2019, 12:36:33 AM

Welcome

I take the opportunity to make splits with any extra capped queen cells. If your hive just swarmed then there are at least a few queen cells that are probably capped. If there are still enough bees, you can just remove a frame that has at least one q-cell, put that in a nuc with a frame of pollen/nectar/honey. As long as you leave at least one or two q-cells in the original hive, they will make their own queen. I would cancel your queen order. You would only be gaining about a week in terms of the time the queen starts laying.

BeeMaster2 · May 23, 2019, 06:06:56 AM

Welcome to Beemaster.
Nucs are miniature hives that we start hives from not make splits from. I suspect that you are feeding this hive. There is a good chance that the bees were taking in so moch sugar water that they back filled the brood area and the queen did not have enough room to lay eggs.
By the way, bees build queen cups year around. You only need to bee concerned when you find eggs and larvae in them.
What does the brood pattern look like?
Is it a nice solid capped brood areas?
Jim Altmiller

Oldbeavo · May 23, 2019, 07:22:33 AM

Cnewly, beekeeping involves a lot of thinking, problem solving etc.
In hindsight, you had the 5 frame nuc that your bees came in as an option for a split.
The bees must have been in swarm mode and the cups must have been active (did they have an egg or royal jelly in them) because putting them into 8 frames should have been enough to reduce crowding and slow down swarming. They were going whether you liked it or not.
To put the queen and a frame of brood in your nuc was the only chance.
Its a steep learning curve at the start.

Ben Framed · May 23, 2019, 08:37:44 AM

Quote from: Oldbeavo on May 23, 2019, 07:22:33 AM
Cnewly, beekeeping involves a lot of thinking, problem solving etc.
In hindsight, you had the 5 frame nuc that your bees came in as an option for a split.
The bees must have been in swarm mode and the cups must have been active (did they have an egg or royal jelly in them) because putting them into 8 frames should have been enough to reduce crowding and slow down swarming. They were going whether you liked it or not.
To put the queen and a frame of brood in your nuc was the only chance.
Its a steep learning curve at the start.

Sounds logical, good comments here from you all.