Help with first two hives (from swarms)

SystemShark · May 20, 2008, 02:31:34 PM

From my eariler posts I obtained my first set of bees from swarm captures and now that its been a few days I have some questions.

The bees in "Thing 1", my first swarm, do not seem very active. It was about the size of a soccerball, maybe smaller - when I cut it out. We had to drive home about 45mins and I don't think the container I had them in was properly ventilated. Anyway I immediately put them in the hive I had set up, Did that Friday night. its Tuesday now and when its really sunny out I do see a few flying around but generally I don't seem them unless I open it up (which I've done 3 times so far). They don't seem to have moved from where I put them, inbetween frame 7-8. Still very much bunched up and have actually kinda spread the two frames further apart than they were. I have not spotted the queen yet, but really I've been trying to not to open/inspect them that much (its very hard!).

Sunday I made a mason jar feeder and put some syrup in there, covered it with an empty medium super and put it on. Today I was thinking that maybe too much air is in there, and they are too cold. I could cut out some cardboard to place inbetween the boxes, cut a hole out so they have access to the feeder. Its been pretty nice out for PA the past few days... a little rainy but some nice sun spots. Cool/windy. Maybe I should move them somewhere to give them more direct sunlight? Currently they only get it from about 2pm-6pm I would guess because they are on the porch and half the day the sun is on the other side of the building. Options are kind of limited tho.

The bees in "Thing 2", my second swarm, seem to be doing a little better. That swarm was easily twice the size, larger than a basketball and the trip home was shorter. They are in two medium supers and although they seem to be favoring the right side of the hive I do seem them flying often. Today I found allot of dead bees on the ground and I took some video of one of the bees "Break dancing" I was laughing a bit at first but now I got to thinking that they might have some kind of problem, I've seen them do it more than a few times. Any ideas? Anything I should be concerned about? Haven't seen the queen in this one either. No feeder on this one just yet, Think I'll try the baggy feeder again this weekend.

Oh and last thing - my mentor said it would be a good time to treat for mites while they havn't built any comb/brood yet. Apiguard I think was the one he said...1-2 strips. I was hoping to go as natural as possible, so how much of a chemical is that considered? Are there other options? What about the powdered sugar shake?

3 pix and the video at photobucket

http://s213.photobucket.com/albums/cc304/SystemShark/Bees%20at%20home/

oh and my girlfriend and I decided it would be fun to start a blog for our beekeeping hobby. Its really just a log for our own reference but its out there! http://ourhoneybees.blogspot.com

indypartridge · May 21, 2008, 07:01:10 AM

Overall, it sounds like you're on the right track. More sun is always good, but I live in the woods, so I have the same issue of shade all the time.

Quote from: SystemShark on May 20, 2008, 02:31:34 PM
Oh and last thing - my mentor said it would be a good time to treat for mites while they havn't built any comb/brood yet. Apiguard I think was the one he said...1-2 strips. I was hoping to go as natural as possible, so how much of a chemical is that considered? Are there other options? What about the powdered sugar shake?

I don't treat for mites unless I know that I have a problem. I have screened bottom boards and use powdered sugar when my mite counts gets high (using a sticky board). Swarming itself combats mites because the brood cycle is interrupted.

SystemShark · May 21, 2008, 02:02:23 PM

thanks for the response.

I found even more dead bees infront of Thing 2 this afternoon. Any ideas? is that breakdancing thing an indication of a disease?

Thanks again =))

Kathyp · May 21, 2008, 02:34:43 PM

i'm not clear on whether you began to feed immediately. it is critical, in my opinion, to get food to a swam or even a cutout. with a swarm, they may have gone 2 or 3 days without a home. then you bring them back and it takes a couple of days for them to locate food and begin bringing it home. in the mean time, they need to be building comb and getting the place ready for the queen to do her thing. with a cut out, you have torn up their home, taken their stores, and dislocated them. again, they need to rebuild and locate food.

i agree that mite treatment is probably not needed if you have picked up a swarm. no brood, no mite cycle. it might be different with a cutout, but considering the disruption they have been through, I'm not sure i'd consider treating. apiguard is temp dependent and takes 30 days of treatment. i use it in the late summer as the last warm weather thing i do before getting ready for winter. it is probably about as natural a treatment as you can use.

if you want to do something to knock off hitchhikers mites that you brought in, you might want to dust them with powdered sugar. that way you'll get a lot of them knocked off before you have lots of brood again. P S is only going to work if you are using screened bottom boards, or some other bottom arrangement that allows the mites to drop below and not reattach to the bees.

the dance you see is probably workers coming back to tell the others where food is to be found.

SystemShark · May 21, 2008, 05:11:39 PM

okay I wasn't sure what to do about the swarm. I'm even more worried now that the food problem is causing all the deaths. I'll get some sugar syrup on them right away. Is there any other food option I need to consider? Thanks - I'm a big time newbie with this and I hope I didn't cause too much damage already.

KONASDAD · May 21, 2008, 05:47:10 PM

I haven't been feeding my swarms b/c flow is strong right now. Its important to keep bees cool and ventilated while driving. I like the cardboard box idea as its not airtight, or nucs w/ screend bottoms or sides. Feed if you want . They should be active if the weather is good. I find swarms to be very active almost as soon as i release them into nuc. Be patient and if you think they wont make it, combine w/ other swarm. Put hive w/ queen on top so if there are 2 queens, she is likely to win.

Kathyp · May 21, 2008, 06:32:39 PM

i only fed mine the first few days. after that, they were out and bringing in stuff. one had been in a box for almost 3 days, and one had been in a tree for two before i got them. it only took them a couple of days to get out and start bringing stuff in, however, if i had not fed, they would have been 4 or 5 days with nothing. that's a pretty tough beginning. probably depends some on where you are and what your weather is like. + i figure it is good incentive for them to stay where i put them :-)

SystemShark · May 21, 2008, 08:01:16 PM

I moved the mason jar feeder out of the first swarm box and on to an area where both can access it, inbetween the two hives. I dusted one of the hives with powdered sugar and even squirted them a bit with my syrup spray bottle. Hopefully that solves the feeding issue, hopefully I didn't over feed ^^

Do they eat the powdered sugar too? Weather looks like its going to be nicer the rest of the week so heres hoping things start to work out. The first swarm/hive is still tightly in a ball where I placed them - what does that mean? I figured they would be out and about exploring the new hive and building out on the frames, no dice yet.

Thanks again you guys and gals rock!

Pond Creek Farm · May 22, 2008, 12:17:49 AM

Why treat until you are sure there is a problem? I, too, share your desire to keep things as natural as possible, so I have not added any medication. I have added SBB's and am monitoring mite falls. I am going to give one of my hives a powdered sugar shake in that I found several mites in same brood/burr comb that I cut out. I have no supers on, so I am not concerned with the sugar getting in the honey frames.