Help - really painful arm a day after stings

[tlynn]

Just want to make sure this is in the realm of normal and not something problematic - I am working to desensitize myself to stings and gave myself 2 stings in the same area mid forearm yesterday.  No immediate reaction, a little sting of course.  But in the middle of the night it woke me up, swelling from wrist up arm maybe 5 or 6 inches.  Today it feels like somebody has been drilling holes in my arm with a cordless.  I mean really uncomfortable, like I'm pacing around.  Ice helps some but very painful.  Skin is hot and taught.  I am heading to the pharmacy for some antihistamines.  Other stings a little puffy, itchy, sore no big deal compared to this.  Anybody else experience strong, delayed, deep achy pain like this?

[Bill W.]

Sounds perfectly normal to me.  As I have been desensitizing myself, the ache was the first thing to ease, then the itching, and I'm still working on the swelling.

[rast]

 Yep, one on my right forearm was the worst. Swelling, red and itching for 4 days. Next worst was just below and behind my ankle for pain and swelling, only 2 days though.

[deejaycee]

My husband describes forearm stings as like having the pain of a broken arm for at least two days.  Elsewhere not nearly so much.   

Certainly I've had facial stings without a fraction of the dram... errr... apparent pain.. he has been in.

On the same vein though, I do remember when I had dog bites to my forearm they were certainly more painful than they would have been elsewhere.

i'd suggest finding a different site to sting. 

Torso stings I find are by far the easiest - lots of flesh to absorb the effects, plenty of space for swelling to 'spread' without becoming constricted and tight.  Stings to the back for me are as easy as a good mozzy bite (avoiding of course the spine and around armpits/lymph node areas).

When you're stinging, keep in mind how painful that area would be if you were getting a tattoo (you can look up on the net if you don't know)... that'll give you an indication of how 'nervy' the area is, and of course tattooing over shallow bone is always more painful. 

Stinging a less senstiive area will do the same to de-sensitise you to the venom, but it will make it a lot easier to handle.  you can go back to more challenging areas once you've built up a bit.

[marliah]

sounds like the sting I had to the leg the other day (well 3 days ago), I got a lump about 4 inches and it hurt something terrible, my whole leg ached. Now its fine and I can barely tell where I got stung.

So you are intentionally getting stung to reduce sensitivity? does that build up immunity for life? or is it something ongoing you have to do to have a reduced reaction?

[Moonshae]

Try to keep the swollen area elevated above the heart; all the dilated blood vessels cause pooling of the blood, which increases pressure and causes pain. Keeping the swollen area above the heart allows more blood to drain than collect, and causes substantially less discomfort.

[tlynn]

Thanks for the reassurance all.    I'm taking tylenol and benadryl and keeping it iced/elevated.  Broken arm is a good descriptor.  unbelievable.  kind of freaking me out a bit the thought of working the bees next time.  I think it's back to gloves until I can build some more immunity.  From deejaycee's recommendation I'll consider different places, definitely not the arms for a while.

Tracy

[Bill W.]

If it is any consolation, it took me about 12 stings, spaced at four day intervals, to go from painful ache to just slight tenderness.

Only eleven to go!   :-D

[Bill W.]

BTW, I can't remember where I read the research, but about half of people respond to bee venom primarily with production of histamine and about half respond primarily with production of leukotrienes.  If you are in the leukotriene crowd, the Benadryl may not do much for you, as it works on histamine.

So, if it doesn't make any improvement, you might want to look into a leukotriene inhibitor instead.

[Kathyp]

multiple stings does not = immunity.  some people seem to build up a resistance.  others, like me, seem not to.  depending on where i am stung, it is either red, swollen, and painful, or swollen to the point that the skin weeps and blisters.  i try to avoid getting stung.

[SgtMaj]

multiple stings does not = immunity.  some people seem to build up a resistance.  others, like me, seem not to.  depending on where i am stung, it is either red, swollen, and painful, or swollen to the point that the skin weeps and blisters.  i try to avoid getting stung.

If you see an alergist, they'll give you shots that basically equals about a beesting a day.  That's how they boost your immunity to it.  My wife get's shots twice a week for grass pollen, some type of mold, and cat dander.  She's been getting those shots for about a year and half now, and it's really made a big difference for her, but for about the first 6 months or so, she couldn't really tell a difference.  So my only point being that it takes both frequency and time.  In your case I would probably recommend the allergist method, as shots that go directly to the bloodstream are probably less likely to irritate you than a sting in the skin where the venom tends to stay around the injection site longer.

[KONASDAD]

If your arm is arm is getting red and hot, you have developed an infection. I was stung once, and i got staph infection and needed antibiotics. i guess bee must have gotten water from something dirty and passed it to me. Just a thought. only you can tell if its just a bad reaction, or worse. Swelling and some itching is normal, a hot arm or skin is not. Look for a red band as well.

[Bill W.]

If your arm is arm is getting red and hot, you have developed an infection. I was stung once, and i got staph infection and needed antibiotics.

Not necessarily true.  I have large local reactions to stings.  A sting on my forearm used to cause swelling from armpit to finger tips, accompanied by redness, heat, and swelling.

The classical symptoms of an immune reaction are rubor, dolor, and calor (redness, pain, and heat) and an immune reaction to toxins is indistinguishable from a reaction to infection.  You probably just had less dramatic reactions to stings.

Of course, tlynn, lacking the experience to know the difference, might want to have this checked out just to be sure.

[eri]

As the various responses here indicate, different people have different reactions at different times under different circumstances at different locations. Red and hot is normal for me, swelling and itching also. I was stung about 36 hours ago on the forearm and the reaction so far is less intense than previous stings, but I don't take that to indicate that I'm developing a resistance. I too, try to avoid getting stung, and let nature take its course.

[SgtMaj]

If your arm is arm is getting red and hot, you have developed an infection. I was stung once, and i got staph infection and needed antibiotics.

Not necessarily true.  I have large local reactions to stings.  A sting on my forearm used to cause swelling from armpit to finger tips, accompanied by redness, heat, and swelling.

The classical symptoms of an immune reaction are rubor, dolor, and calor (redness, pain, and heat) and an immune reaction to toxins is indistinguishable from a reaction to infection.  You probably just had less dramatic reactions to stings.

Of course, tlynn, lacking the experience to know the difference, might want to have this checked out just to be sure.

At first I was thinking that only one of the two stings has developed this reaction, which would lead me to think it's likely an infection as well.  But after re-reading the post, I realized that it didn't specify that... so I'm posting this to say nothing in particular, I should run for public office.

Isn't there an OTC drug to block leukotrienes?  Or are they all prescription drugs?

[tlynn]

It's been about 42 hrs and I don't believe there's any infection.  The heat has mostly subsided along with some pain but now swollen from fingers to elbow.  The hotness occurred only a few hours after the stings so I wouldn't think an infection could get established that quickly.  I'm interested in the histamine vs. lueukotrenes idea because the benadryl is just making me feel drugged and the swelling hasn't gone down.  If anything it's gotten a little worse. 

All in all pretty alarming for not having experienced this before.  I just about thought my arm was going to fall off at first!

[Kathyp]

the benadryl only really works if you take it when you get stung.  if you allow the reaction to happen, it's to late to block the histamines later.  i carry a bottle of liquid benadryl with me when i do cutouts and swarms.  if i get stung, i take a swig.  so far, this has really helped keep my reactions down.  the effect of the benadryl gets used up as it blocks the histamines.  you will have to take it more than once in the 1st 24. 

http://209.85.141.104/search?q=cache:0n5sFKD_JugJ:www.cals.ncsu.edu/entomology/apiculture/PDF%2520files/Marterre.2006b.pdf+leukotriene+reaction+to+bee+stings&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=1&gl=us

[SgtMaj]

I would think you could also take benedryl prior to getting stung so there's no delay in digesting the medicine to the point where it begins to kick in.  Of course, that would also mean taking it even though there is no guarantee you would even get stung... but if you have bad reactions to stings, the possibility of needless consumption of medicine might be outweighed by the benefits of no delay in it's effectiveness.

[poka-bee]

A couple of months ago I accidently brushed a bunch of bees & got about 10 stings on my inner forearm..whooeee!  Wasn't so bad @first.  Ran in, put on my suit :roll: & took 2 benedryl.  Put everything back together, wasn't too bad that night. The next morning my arm had swelled up & it felt like a deep,deep bruise pain in the muscles of my whole arm. I didn't notice my chronic shoulder pain for a few days after that one! Ibuprofun did help some too. My arm was making fluid faster than the lymphatic system could flush & I had a "bat flap" of an inch or so swinging from my forearm, like old ladies tricepts.. :evil: was great fun to gross people out!  It had that deep pain for about 3 days.  I am much more careful now!  ;) Jody

[tlynn]

Day 3 and the arm is still a little puffy but no pain.  Whew, at least I'll know what to expect when I get stung on the arm again.  Can't wait for a face hit!  That ought to be a dandy.  Still pondering what area to sting myself next.  This time only once and I won't leave in the stinger.

I really appreciate all the feedback.  It kept me from flipping out and from running to a doctor who would have had me do just what I did and charged a lot of money.

We were at a beekeeping seminar a few weeks ago and the former chief apiary inspector (for like 30 years) gave a bee yard demo.  He had been working bees since he was 10 and probably was in late 60s or early 70s.  He broke down a couple hives and went through them for us, no veil and short sleeves.  I watched him get stung 3 times in the arms and once on the cheek.  He stopped to show us the stingers and then scraped them out with his hive tool.  Probably didn't even get a blemish.