Sound like a new queen?

bassman1977 · August 13, 2008, 06:43:55 PM

I got out to one of my hives about 2 weeks ago to do a routine inspection and primarily to ensure it was queen rite. I saw bees, no brood, no eggs, plenty of capped honey, plenty of room, a bit of pollen, no sign of queen. There are a couple open supercedure cells but they looked old. I gave them a frame of eggs and go back out a couple days later. No queen cell, no brood, no nothing in that frame (which had me scratching my head). I searched the remainder of the hive...same story. I figure I have a queenless hive. Luckily I identified the problem early enough to correct. I ordered a queen and hived her last night after going through the hive two more times to check and recheck that there is no signs of a queen. This evening, I went out to manually release her, something which I have done many times before with success each time. Keep in mind she was caged in the hive for 24 hours (almost exactly). So I open the cage and put her in the hive. She immediately gets balled. Obvious stinging motions by the worker in an effort to assassinate my $28 bug. The attendants also were whacked. $^*!?!?

Let's say that this hive had a newly emerged queen after all. Fine and dandy, she'll be producing soon. What if there isn't? Would a hive ball a new queen that quickly even if she was in the hive that was queenless...especially after 24 hours?!?

After seeing what I did, my gut tells me newly emerged queen.

I'm curious for opinions.

annette · August 13, 2008, 06:50:51 PM

Sounds like it to me, you may already have a new queen.

JP · August 13, 2008, 07:39:20 PM

Perhaps your queen shut down on you but her scent is still in the hive so they 86'd the newbie is my thought since you say you have no brood of any kind.

...JP

Michael Bush · August 13, 2008, 08:17:31 PM

http://www.bushfarms.com/beesfallacies.htm#nobroodnoqueen

The best insurance is a frame of open brood and eggs. They are or aren't queenless and there really is no way to tell if there is a virgin queen in the hive for sure.

bassman1977 · August 13, 2008, 08:29:45 PM

QuoteThe best insurance is a frame of open brood and eggs.

That was my thought too and I did do that, however after two days I went back to see if there was a cup and the whole thing was cleaned out. There was brood in there and eggs. I'm positive of both. I'll wait and see what happens in a couple more weeks. If the hive is queenless, I will have to combine most likely. It's not a very big hive.

JP · August 13, 2008, 09:41:09 PM

Quote from: bassman1977 on August 13, 2008, 08:29:45 PM
QuoteThe best insurance is a frame of open brood and eggs.

That was my thought too and I did do that, however after two days I went back to see if there was a cup and the whole thing was cleaned out. There was brood in there and eggs. I'm positive of both. I'll wait and see what happens in a couple more weeks. If the hive is queenless, I will have to combine most likely. It's not a very big hive.

My guess is you have a queen and the hive is on hold for one of the reasons Michael mentioned.

...JP

Brian D. Bray · August 14, 2008, 02:05:32 AM

Quote from: JP on August 13, 2008, 09:41:09 PM
Quote from: bassman1977 on August 13, 2008, 08:29:45 PM
QuoteThe best insurance is a frame of open brood and eggs.

That was my thought too and I did do that, however after two days I went back to see if there was a cup and the whole thing was cleaned out. There was brood in there and eggs. I'm positive of both. I'll wait and see what happens in a couple more weeks. If the hive is queenless, I will have to combine most likely. It's not a very big hive.

My guess is you have a queen and the hive is on hold for one of the reasons Michael mentioned.

...JP

During a dearth the queen will quit laying completely. No sign of brood but the hive is and acts queen right. Putting a frame of brood in the hive in that situation will cause the bees to cannabalize the brood frame to conserver stores. Dearth means no, or very little, nectar source so it is a survival mode.
That is what I get from your post.

bassman1977 · August 14, 2008, 09:32:51 AM

QuotePutting a frame of brood in the hive in that situation will cause the bees to cannabalize the brood frame to conserver stores.

I've never heard of that happening (the cannibalizing) but it makes a lot of sense. We do have a big goldenrod flow going on now (started about a week ago) so maybe she'll start laying soon.

Thanks for all the input everyone.