Ball of bees!?

jeremy_c · June 24, 2009, 04:48:33 PM

I went out to my hives this afternoon and on my newest hive (captured from a swarm 3 weeks ago) I heard a loud buzzing noise. I went to investigate and found a ball of bees on the ground. I am unsure of what they are doing. Here is a picture:

Does anyone know what they are doing?

Jeremy

jeremy_c · June 24, 2009, 04:50:23 PM

Oh, size wise, a bit bigger (but not much) than a golf ball.

Jeremy

jeremy_c · June 24, 2009, 04:53:22 PM

Um, one more thing I meant to mention, sorry... This was under the left-rear corner of the hive. I moved the hive for a minute (only 1 deep) to get a better view of what was going on.

Jeremy

jdpro5010 · June 24, 2009, 04:55:57 PM

They are probably balling an intruder such as a carpenter bee, but I would also check to see if they are not balling a queen. They may be trying to supersede her.

jeremy_c · June 24, 2009, 04:59:34 PM

I tried to split it up a bit to see what was going on but man, they were bound tightly! I took two sticks and tried to separate them w/o luck.

About the queen, I hope not! This hive is two weeks old and the queen has been laying like crazy. A terrific brood pattern and almost 3 full frames of capped brood. I think she may be my best queen, if they are not happy with her, I'm not sure they will be happy with anyone :-D

Jeremy

JP · June 24, 2009, 05:06:27 PM

There's most likey a queen in there they are balling. I would pull them apart, cage the queen and make a nuc. Check the parent hive and make sure you have a queen in there.

Sometimes very stressed bees will also ball a queen and kill her.

...JP

jeremy_c · June 24, 2009, 05:28:08 PM

It was the queen. I got her however, I'm stuck on what to do now!? I have some queen cages, but how do I get her into a queen cage? Right now she is in a not so good spot of a tupper ware container, w/a little air vent. How long will she last w/o worker bees to feed her, how do I setup a nuc with bees from my other hives in the same apiary? (I only have one place).

Jeremy

Kathyp · June 24, 2009, 05:40:30 PM

queens do not take care of themselves. you need to get some workers in with her and hope they do not kill her.....

you can use one of your queen cages. if they are the wood cages with screen, you can peel the screen back, place queen and a few workers in, and reattach the screen. you can also make a cage on a frame with some wire mesh. Michael Bush has a thing on his site about a push cage. probably your best bet for a nuc and the queen.

http://forum.beemaster.com/index.php/topic,15047.0.html

http://forum.beemaster.com/index.php/topic,14680.0.html

JP · June 24, 2009, 05:42:31 PM

What I would do is put her in a cool dark spot in your house, over night, offer her a small bit of water, a small bit of honey.

Shake bees from one of your hives into say a three frame nuc. You can create a three frame from a medium or another nuc, just use a divider to seal off the rest of the set up.

The bees you shake are queenless and need a queen. In the morning or after 4-5 hours, open the top of the nuc and place the caged queen on top and guage their reaction to her, they should accept her, then you could set them up.

Oh, I would do this away from your apiary if at all possible as the bees you shook would want to go back to their parent hive.

You could move them away for a couple of days or so then move them back. A couple of miles away would be fine.

...JP

jeremy_c · June 24, 2009, 05:50:35 PM

Quote from: JP on June 24, 2009, 05:42:31 PM
What I would do is put her in a cool dark spot in your house, over night, offer her a small bit of water, a small bit of honey.

Any worker bees?

Jeremy

JP · June 24, 2009, 06:01:12 PM

Try and include some attendants if you can, but none if they are seeming hostile towards her, they could sting her to death. She should be ok for several hours or even over night if she is not too stressed and offer the water and drop of feed.

Have to run, hope this helps, good luck!

...JP

jeremy_c · June 24, 2009, 07:29:11 PM

Should I give them a frame of brood w/the nursing bees that are on that frame? Also, this late in the season, is there any reason to actually do this, i.e. save the queen, start a brand new nuc?

Jeremy

jeremy_c · June 24, 2009, 07:31:57 PM

Oh, btw.. the hive I thought this queen came from has the queen in it. I have no idea where this queen came from :-/ None of my routine inspections have shown any queen cells in any of my hives, so I'm pretty confused.

Jeremy

Kathyp · June 24, 2009, 07:41:30 PM

there is still time. you may have to feed depending on your flow. i just started 2 nucs and my season is probably shorter than yours.

it's easy to miss a queen cell. you may have had two queens for awhile in one hive. they may have just decided to boot one. they tear out the cells when they are done, so if you missed it on inspection, it is gone now.

if you want to make a nuc, make it with frames of brood. this gives the hive numbers until the new brood hatches out.

JP · June 25, 2009, 12:37:16 AM

Quote from: jeremy_c on June 24, 2009, 07:29:11 PM
Should I give them a frame of brood w/the nursing bees that are on that frame? Also, this late in the season, is there any reason to actually do this, i.e. save the queen, start a brand new nuc?

Jeremy

If for no other reason, this small colony could be a side project that you could learn from. After a waiting period and after introducing the queen, I would give them a few frames of brood with eggs or very young larvae. They may still go ahead and supersede this queen but so what, there will be learning in the process.

Then again, they may accept and keep her and then build up and surprise you with their performance.

My bet is the hive this queen came from superseded this queen.

Have fun and report back with your findings and good luck, ain't bees fun??

...JP

jdpro5010 · June 25, 2009, 04:23:41 PM

Quote from: jeremy_c on June 24, 2009, 07:29:11 PM
Should I give them a frame of brood w/the nursing bees that are on that frame? Also, this late in the season, is there any reason to actually do this, i.e. save the queen, start a brand new nuc?

Jeremy

Yea Jeremy you should be alright doing a split now. Just be sure to feed them. I am actually going to make 12 nucs in 2 weeks, I just plan on feeding them at least until the goldenrod flow.

jdpro5010 · June 25, 2009, 04:28:45 PM

Quote from: jeremy_c on June 24, 2009, 07:31:57 PM
Oh, btw.. the hive I thought this queen came from has the queen in it. I have no idea where this queen came from :-/ None of my routine inspections have shown any queen cells in any of my hives, so I'm pretty confused.

Jeremy

What you may be seeing is the daughter queen who is in the hive and laying. A lot of times the hive will let the 2 exist together until they are sure the new queen is laying. After the new queen is laying they toss out the old one. The other option is that this queen was a virgin returning from her mating flight and went to the wrong house! :-D