Hive swarms out and then returns, Why???

annette · March 28, 2010, 10:53:03 PM

I know this has been mentioned here before, but today a hive swarmed out right in front of me. It ended up on a branch about 25 feet up an oak tree. It was a very large swarm and remained there for about 40 minutes and then it flew right back into the same hive again.

I took advantage of this opportunity and split the hive into 2 other hives.

My question is why did they come back to the hive???

What are the chances of them swarming out again after I split them twice??

Just curious about all this.

By the way, this was the first time I ever saw a swarm and it was unbelievable. So exciting.

Thanks
Annette

kedgel · March 29, 2010, 12:11:26 AM

If they can't find a preferable alternative, they sometimes go back home until a better one is found. Good move splitting them. You got lucky! When I've had bees swarm, they leave without so much as a thank-you and never come back. (Kinda like some other girls I've known!) ;)

Kelly

Two Bees · March 29, 2010, 09:39:30 AM

I've heard that if the queen returns to the hive for whatever reason, the others will follow her back into the original hive. Then, they will swarm again after a short while.

Good thing that you split the hive.

CVBees · March 29, 2010, 10:08:59 AM

Quote from: kedgel on March 29, 2010, 12:11:26 AM
You got lucky! When I've had bees swarm, they leave without so much as a thank-you and never come back. (Kinda like some other girls I've known!) ;)

Kelly

:lau: too funny

Well planned visit Annette, a reward for your caring nature I am sure.

JP · March 29, 2010, 10:44:05 AM

Annette, swarms return when the queen has not left with them for whatever the reason.

This is the only reason they go back.

I had one leave and try to return after a rain storm came in. They made it within 3' of the hive and were sopping wet. After they dried out and I transferred the queen, they all went in. This was the only exception I've ever observed like this.

...JP

annette · March 29, 2010, 12:48:52 PM

Thanks dear people for the explanations. I feel very grateful for being there to experience it, and for being there to split them right after.

Does this sort of thing happen very often????

Sincerely
Annette

doak · March 29, 2010, 01:10:20 PM

Not real common. The only reason I have ever heard of is if the queen did not go for what ever reason.
Lucky to be there. Hope you got the right combination in each split.
I have had splits swarm soon after they were made. :)doak

Tucker1 · March 29, 2010, 01:39:19 PM

Like JP, I understand that this takes place when the queen does not join the swarm. Usually, it because she has not lost enough weight to fly or has clipped wings. (In which case, you might want to check the ground around the hive.) After a few more Jenny Craig meals she ready to go and swarm. I think you've got only a few days at best before they swarm again. Once they make up their mind it may be very difficult to change it. Being ready for another swarm won't hurt and could prevent a loss of bees. Best of luck.

Regards,
Tucker1

annette · March 29, 2010, 05:19:12 PM

Quote from: doak on March 29, 2010, 01:10:20 PM
Not real common. The only reason I have ever heard of is if the queen did not go for what ever reason.
Lucky to be there. Hope you got the right combination in each split.
I have had splits swarm soon after they were made. :)doak

Doing the splits was my biggest worry to make sure I had all the necessary ingredients to make them successful. I placed a few queen cells in each split, frames of emerging brood, pollen, honey and shook as many bees as I could do comfortably in each split.

One split was just a super I removed from the parent hive since they had everything they needed in that super. The other split was a 5 frame medium nuc, (pretty small) that I intend to donate to the 4H club of Placerville for their beekeeping class.

I felt really good about the outcome, but now we are having a very cold front coming in (snow) this week so I am concerned how they will do. Hopefully the warmer weather will return the following week when the queens will have to go out and get mated. I will be honest, I am worried about that little nuc and how they will do with the coming cold weather this week.
Wish me luck!!

buzzbee · March 29, 2010, 07:07:52 PM

It may seem cold Annette,but lows in the thirties and highs in fifties ans sixties is an average spring for our climate,.
Since you put some stores in both hives they should be fine. The cold may keep them in the hives longer and encourage them to set up housekeeping.
If you have drones out flying you should be okay with the queens getting mated.

Hemlock · March 29, 2010, 09:22:27 PM

One of my colonies tried to swarm multiple times last spring. They'd all buzz out to a tree limb and hang out for an hour or so. 3 times they did this but always went back into the hive. The fourth time (that I know of) the queen joined them and they left for good.

When they didn't fully swarm the weather was predicted to be cold & rainy. They finally made it during a week of warm sunny weather. So perhaps they know your weather is going to be bad and will wait until it gets better.

I didn't try to stop them because the queen was the MEANEST queen in VA. I wanted her to go. Now I have her daughter, who is only 'half' the meanest queen in VA. I'm hoping the granddaughter will be tolerable though.

Good Luck..

Beaver Dam · March 29, 2010, 09:47:19 PM

Health care passed. There covered untill 26 under parents plan. :roll: :-D

Sparky · March 29, 2010, 10:52:04 PM

Quote from: Hemlock on March 29, 2010, 09:22:27 PM
One of my colonies tried to swarm multiple times last spring. They'd all buzz out to a tree limb and hang out for an hour or so. 3 times they did this but always went back into the hive. The fourth time (that I know of) the queen joined them and they left for good.

When they didn't fully swarm the weather was predicted to be cold & rainy. They finally made it during a week of warm sunny weather. So perhaps they know your weather is going to be bad and will wait until it gets better.

I didn't try to stop them because the queen was the MEANEST queen in VA. I wanted her to go. Now I have her daughter, who is only 'half' the meanest queen in VA. I'm hoping the granddaughter will be tolerable though.

Good Luck..

Sounds like a completely new blood line is in order and give the old queen the hive tool test. :-D

schawee · March 29, 2010, 11:26:26 PM

ANNETTE, MY BEES SWARMED TODAY IN FRONT OF ME .HALF WENT ON A BRANCH AND THE OTHER HALF WENT BACK IN THE HIVE .I DID GET THE SWARM WITH THE QUEEN.I DONT KNOW WHY THE OTHER HALF WENT BACK IN THE HIVE. ...SCHAWEE

b reeves · March 30, 2010, 08:46:15 AM

if it is turning colder makle sure you feed them, or at least scratch the caps off the stores they have
Bob

annette · March 30, 2010, 03:04:40 PM

You know I also had the feeling that they knew the weather was turning colder by the next day and decided to return.

Whatever the reason, at least now I know that it is a normal situation for them to return.

Very interesting things you all have posted here for me to read.

I appreciate all the responses.

I will keep you all posted on how the splits all turn out.

Annette

tillie · March 30, 2010, 05:13:04 PM

Hi Annette,

In Winston's book the Biology of the Honey Bee, he says that the most common reason for the swarm to return is if the queen didn't go with them. Ahead of swarming the bees run the queen around the hive and keep her exercising to slim her down so that she can fly. They then do several runs of bees through the hive toward the entrance in an effort to sort of push the queen out the door. Sometimes all the enthusiasm is there for the bees but the queen who doesn't want to leave, basically, doesn't make it out the door, so the swarm returns and regroups and tries later.

Linda T in Atlanta

annette · March 30, 2010, 07:00:49 PM

Thanks Linda,

I thought they stopped feeding her to slim her down?? So this is funny that they exercise her.