Middle of winter - picked up a small log with some bees and comb - advice needed

[OzBuzz]

Hey Everybody,

It's winter down here in Oz... I got a call the other day from a guy who was chopping up a tree - he found a small hive in the branch he was chopping up. He cut it down about three weeks ago and i went and picked it up tonight... surprisingly the bees are still there. Does this mean the Queen will be there too? In any case it's a tiny hive, maybe a few hundred bees... I didnt want to cut the comb out so i have a medium box with drawn frames on the bottom, then i have sat a full depth super and put the log in that, and then on top of that a medium with a few other drawn frames just to support a zip lock bag of sugar syrup. I'm hoping that the bees will move on to the drawn comb in the bottom medium box and leave the log (or atleast get sufficiently established in the medium frames for me to cut out the comb in the log and put it in to a frame). Is it worth my getting a queen? Does what i have setup sound like the best way? Any advice would be appreciated

[jgaito]

it's too small to survive.   it can be combined with another hive or if the queen is there you could try a nuc hive and feed them.

[Kathyp]

i think i would have done as you have.  if you rip it up at this time of the year, it will die for sure.  if you just shelter and feed it through the winter, it might make it.  odd not in it's favor, but who knows?

you may have a mess to clean up in spring if they do survive.

[harvey]

sounds like a plan,  only time will tell and if you do nothing they will not survive for sure.  Now they are a lot more protected from the elements so maybe they will when it warms up move up into the drawn comb.  You have nothing to loose and possible a good feral hive to gain.

[OzBuzz]

Thanks everybody for your thoughts... they're beautiful bees and, from what i can see, smaller than the other bees i have - they have a nice orange brown abdomen with about 4-5 black bands across. Are they likely italian? I took the top medium off this morning and put the bag full of sugar water near the entrance on the outside of the hive. I didnt puncture the bag properly and it was flowing (slowly) out of the bag and i didnt want a pool of liquid on the base board of the hive for them to drown in. So i decided to take the bag out. There's a nice coating of sugar water on the log they were in as well as some on the frames and the base so i figure that will keep them going for a while until i can get the bag to work properly and i can put it back in the box - alternatively they might venture out of the hive and find it. I also tilted the box forward so that any sugar water that had gathered on the base would run out. Rather than sitting the sugar bag on top of some medium frames above the full depth super i might just sit it on top of the small log on a tray - it will help keep some of the heat in the log at night. I also collected a second log which had comb and a few bees in it - i put them in a second box and bought them home. After i got the bees out of there and in to the box i cut that comb out and found some capped brood - a few of the cells had been damaged and i noticed that the pupae were still all white but prety much developed. I was told the tree branch was cut 2 - 3 weeks ago. If that were the case that would say to me that, possibly, the queen is still in that section of comb? When i cut out the brood comb i put it in next to the log in the full depth super - i know it's not in the brood nest and they're probably chilled and dead but i thought it was worth a shot. The logs themself had been sitting in the open with both end chopped off of the colony with wind and rain going in and they survived to date so they're pretty resiliant! and the guy i picked it up from told me that they had been foraging during the day and returning to that log - fingers crossed.

What will it be that would cause these guys to die out? lack of heat? simply lack of numbers? food is easy - i can give them sugar water.

I really would like to try and help these guys through - it's my first ever feral collection and, although i fully appreciate this one is very much touch and go, it would be nice if i could get them through. I've even thought about putting the hive inside my house witha  pip out a window or something coz we have ducted heating.

Also, if they do survive, i know it's going to be an absolute mess come spring but hopefully it will be a case of prying out that log and, if they're smart, they will have colonised the fully drawn out medium frames that i have given them below. My only wnder is about the queen! i hope she i there!

[Kathyp]

lack of heat? simply lack of numbers

how cold are your winters?  if they will tuck down in that log piece and not try to expand in cold weather AND if there are enough young bees to make it through winter AND if you can keep them fed....who knows?  you have nothing to lose by trying.

[OzBuzz]

Some nights it gets below zero oC (freezing) and i don't think there are huge numbers of bees in the log! i worry they might die out if the queen isnt laying. If i moved them inside where it was warm would that encourage her to lay a little (assuming she is present).

Keeping the feed up to them isnt a problem

[OzBuzz]

So i had a look at the hive yesterday afternoon and they're definitely collecting nectar and pollen from flowers around our house... i've also provided them with some sugar water and dry sugar sitting at the entrance of the hive. For now there are a few eating the sugar water, none eating the dry sugar, and quite a few flying out in to the field and coming back loaded with some pollen. Their desire to keep the hive going by them is awesome... they're also providing a degree of defensive action for the hive. I noticed a feral bee try and feed on the bag of sugar water and they weren't going to have a bar of that and they ran him off good and proper. Also, last night i was shining a torch in the entrance and a few bees came to inspect what was going on and flew at the torch. I lifted the lid on the hive too and had a look inside - the bees are working the medium frames below the log (thankfully these are already fully drawn so they just have to put the nectar/pollen in to them and, hopefully, if there is a queen present then she will start laying in there). It appears that at night they retreat in to the log that is sitting on top of the frames for the night. I just really hope there is a queen in there! is there an easy, not so invasive way, of checking? I was trying to do some of the math based on the fact that i did find some capped brood - but that could have been there for a while and died not long after the branch fell. There are some young looking bees amongst them though. Is it worth possibly trying to track down a queen and put the cage in there and see how they react? if the hive is queen right they would just kill her wouldnt they?

[Kathyp]

the best thing you can probably do is reduce the entrance, feed, and see what happens.  odds are long, but they might make it.  sometimes our desire to help is not helpful  :-D

[OzBuzz]

Thnks Kathy, i'll do that - they already have quite a small entrance - probaby 2 inches across...