Swarm in old deep behind store...what to do??

[hollybees]

Hello Everyone,
I know this man who owns a store in town and the guy who works for him put an old deep super out back just to see if he would catch a swarm.
His father was a beek recently passed away...and it was one of his.

So I went into the store one day and they tell me about it.(they know I keep bees because I asked to sell my honey there)
Of course I just gotta see this.....so I go out back and the thing is laying on the ground in the grass at the edge of the parking lot looking sad.
Grass growing in front and spider webs across the entrance.

I went home and got my bee stuff and went back to inspect it.
What I found was a fair amount of bees w/a laying queen and brood, the comb was old and brittle w/holes in it and at least 10 black spiders taking up residence.
I first thought wax moths but it was just spider webs.
They were using 4 of the inner frames they're using some of the old comb but have built comb alongside of it also, it looks like they don't want to use it.
I put the hive on some blocks and gave it an new bottom board, now the question is what to do next.

Oh I forgot to mention they have almost NO stores I did not see any honey very little pollen but there was brood larvae and new eggs.

They look healthy enough I saw no noticeable signs of problems.
I have a single medium hive that I could combined them with but I don't want to chance bringing them to my apiary.
Can I remove the brood from the old frames and put it into a medium frames and condense them into a nuc.

This is longer than I wanted it to be so I'm going to shut-up and listen now.
What would you advise?

Thanks
Paul

[AllenF]

If it were me, I think I would leave them in that box and maybe leave them there if they will let you for now.  (Move them this winter)   And feed the crap out of them.   In a month or 2, you should be able to judge what they are going to do.   They may just be a late swarm, or there might be something wrong with them.   At least this way you could tell.  If there is something wrong with them, let them go, but most likely they will start  to shine with the feed.  You may be able to get them through the winter as a nuc. 

[Kathyp]

feeding is going to be critical if they are going to make it.  if you take them home, i'd put them away from your other bees and feed the snot out of them.  they'll probably be much easier to manage at home as you will be able to keep a close eye on them and not worry about opening them to check.  next year, you can begin to rotate the old comb out.  i wouldn't worry about that now. 

[hollybees]

If it were me, I think I would leave them in that box and maybe leave them there if they will let you for now.  (Move them this winter)   And feed the crap out of them.   In a month or 2, you should be able to judge what they are going to do.   They may just be a late swarm, or there might be something wrong with them.   At least this way you could tell.  If there is something wrong with them, let them go, but most likely they will start  to shine with the feed.  You may be able to get them through the winter as a nuc. 

I like the sound of that Allenf but the guy said the snow plow piles up snow back there in winter so I think I would like to move them.
Leaving them in that box sounds good to me.

feeding is going to be critical if they are going to make it.  if you take them home, i'd put them away from your other bees and feed the snot out of them.  they'll probably be much easier to manage at home as you will be able to keep a close eye on them and not worry about opening them to check.  next year, you can begin to rotate the old comb out.  i wouldn't worry about that now. 

kathyp,
I like the sound of bringing them home, he said I could and I could put them on the other side of the property.

I'm really glad I asked this question because I would have been all about getting them in good comb,
didn't think about feeding because they have natural resources now.
I have some medium frames of honey in the freezer I could drop in, if i were to do that should I still feed sugar as well??

Thanks,
Paul

[AllenF]

Do you think they need to be built up in numbers before fall?  Honey will not build up numbers, you will need to feed 1 to 1 syrup.  I don't think feeding will hurt.   Reduce the entrance to hold off robbing.

[Kathyp]

if they are going to make it, they need to have enough stores to get through winter.  putting in some honey will help a lot but if it's only a couple of frames, i'd still help.  remember, they are still using it if they are still raising brood and you want them to do that right now.

even if there are natural resource around, there have to be enough workers to get it in and stored.  sounds like this hive might not have the manpower.  you want as much brood as possible in the next month or so to give them a chance.

[hollybees]

Thanks I really appreciate the help.
I'm going to get them bring them home reduce the entrance drop in some honey and feed the heck out of them.

What about the combining them idea is that a reasonable option? I've never done it before it would be cool to try it.
New learning experience is always good right!

Thanks again,
Paul

[Kathyp]

to combine you'll need to kill one queen.  you want to do it so that you control which queen survives.  it is an option if you don't think this hive will make it BUT i'd make sure that the new hive is disease free first.

i think i'd give them a month or so to see how they are doing with feeding.  it will let you evaluate the queen and make sure they are disease free.  if they don't look like they are going to make it, you can combine them later.

[OzBuzz]

I'm just going to echo what everyone else has said - feed, feed, feed and don't try and move the old frames out yet. I'd also consider maybe putting a pollen pattie in there to give them the protein they need. If they have all of the food they need at their front door they won't need to fly for it and they can conserve their energy and focus on building up numbers

[Jim134]

 feed, feed, feed And but in pollen pattie my $.02



   BEE HAPPY Jim 134 :)

[hollybees]

Hey,
With you people giving the advice these girls are going to make it just fine.
Feed,Feed,Feed...observe, get their numbers up and give them a chance to make it on their own.

Got It!

Thanks so much,
Paul

[casper_zip]

Paul:

Makes me feel good, you are a caring person, and doing the right thing to take this hive home, give it a great home, a lot of love and care, and make repairs when you can. I feel good, because the bees must have had a bad life, and being able to hang on with limited resources.

Don't see why they won't repay you in spades, the Good Lord put your path on their path and good things can/will happen. I love a good story like this, and please keep us posted/updated. Thanks and all the best,

casper_zip

[hollybees]

I brought the hive home put it my garden and today they used 1 Quart of 1:1
They are bringin' lots of pollen and just lovin" life right now.
Thanks again to for the help!
Paul