very light hives? What would you do?

[harvey]

Hello,  Been a while since I posted but I have been here reading.  I went out to check the hives today and close up some extra openings.  I tilted all the hives slightly forward.  When I did I noticed that all the hives seem very light.  I didn't open any as it is only 32 degrees out but they sure seemed light to me.  They were all in the ok range about a month ago.  Been that long since the bees have been flying!  To late to feed any syrup and I had not wanted to feed at all.  Might have to add some dry sugar or just let nature prevail.  these are all natural cell size and no foundation hives.  All are two deeps.  and all are from ferral swarms.

[Kathyp]

put some dry sugar or a candy board  on, or let them starve.  if you want nature to take care of them, leave them in the trees.  if you are going to be a beekeeper, you are responsible for their care.

i do not mean to seem harsh, but this "natural" thing can be take to far.

[JP]

Have to agree with Kathy, why let them starve to death if you can help them?


...JP

[AllenF]

Ya feed them and check them asap.

[Joelel]

Feed em

:tumbleweed:

[harvey]

I have tomorrow which is supposed to be fairly warm,  In the high 30's could put sugar on them then.   Would you just put newspaper and then dry sugar?   Maybe twenty pounds per hive?   

[Kathyp]

as much as you can fit.  winter is long and you don't want to be constantly checking them if you can avoid it.

[Michael Bush]

http://bushfarms.com/beesfeeding.htm#drysugar

[tecumseh]

kathyp writes:
i do not mean to seem harsh, but this "natural" thing can be take to far.

tecumseh:
not wanting to pile on here but.... yep.

I have never figured out a way to make a honey crop, produce a queen or make up a nuc from a dead hive.  data going back 50 year would tell you that more hives have expired from starvation than all other causes combined.  the real tragedy is this cause is the easiest and cheapest to remedy.  it does require a bit of planning. 

please don't feel so bad at this (most especially if you are new to bees) since the above paragraph should also suggest that the same error has been made over and over again by very capable beekeepers. 

another approach would be to load up some empty frames with syrup (+ a squeegee) and on the first good day plop these  frames up next to the cluster.  dry sugar may be another approach but I have always considered it 'emergency feed' and not something to get a hive thru a harsh winter environment.  with dry sugar alone I would not expect much success with a light hive this early in the winter.

lastly... tipping can sometimes provide a bit of misinformation in itself.  if (for example) in the two deep hive you described all the stores are in the top of the hive tipping can make the unit feel light.  if on the other hand all the stores are located on the side of the hive that is tipped it may feel heavy.

good luck...
   

[edward]

A MEATHOD OF LAST RESORT !

If the problem is that it is to cold out side and the bees have gone into a winter ball / hibernation and have not pulled down their winter feed , You could move the whole hive indoors.

To do this the hive must bee ventilated + contained , so the bees don't escape. put the hive in a warm space ,  a garage , shed

The bees should bee able to pull down their winter food with in in 24 - 48 hours .

when this is done you lift the whole hive outside and they will go into hibernation.

A bit of work but well worth the effort for the lovely ladies

edward  :-P

[danno]

Harvey
Hate to say I told you so but a couple of  months back  I told you to pull your supers and not rob the last flow goldenrod.   Now you have the choises of candy boards, dry sugar as mentioned or you could get a block of fondant.    Fondant is available through distibuters for Dawn foods in Jackson MI.    Its about 25.00 for a 50# block.   I get it from a local bakery.     

[harvey]

I TOLD YOU SO?  I didn't end up pulling any honey form any of the hives.  I did pull the supers and fed that back to hives?   Only honey I got this year was from licking the end of the hive tool?   Anyway,  I am wondering if me tipping the hives up was false info.  I opened one today and it had eight capped frames in the top deep?  still felt light to me.  I have sugar available to feed them if need be and will if needed.  I have built up boxes that are only two inches deep with a fine screen covering half of the bottom.  I will put the sugar on the screen with a mist of water to set it. 

[danno]

Sorry Harvey
sometimes I get aliitle to blunt.   Tipping the hives is something that you need to get a feel for.  I use 2 fingers and tip the back.  If I stuggle or cant lift it it is heavy enough but another problem is were is the cluster and is the food above them.  You could have a heavy hive with the cluster in the top and they will starve in our long hard winter.  If you feed feed on top not the bottom.  They wont find sugar on the bottom board.    Robos candy boards really work well.   The deep full size have about 25#s of sugar and the bees will use it.  The fondant will keep them alive but I find it does give them the squirts abit.  Still it will keep them alive until spring.  Really winter has not even begun in Michigan yet and if there are already  problems they will not get better.  All this emergency feeding in for Feb and March not Nov.  Any way sorry again and good luck

[tecumseh]

edward writes:
a MEATHOD OF LAST RESORT !

tecumseh:
nice post with a different twist.

[edward]

I was about to use it myself on a hive that i got the responsibility of winter feeding to late

They did not want to take there winter feed because of the cold weather , on the day i was going to try to save them with this trick they had decided too take there winter food a few days earlier

I think a short spell of  :evil: warmer :evil: weather did the trick  :roll: so all I had to do was remove the feed bucket and put their winter hat on and tie it all down.

-18c and a class 1 storm warning 2 feet of snow brrr today

It will soon bee the winter solaces , only 4 more months to spring  :roll:

edward  :-P

[harvey]

Ha Danno!  Not to worry,  I did take offense but way to fast and to no avail.   Kathy P hit it right on the head though when she said this natural thing can be taken to far.  So far these hives are as natural as man can make them,  no treatments no nothing.  I am not sure if they have enough food for the winter or not.  Right now most hives look real good in the top box and I did not open the bottom box to see.  I will add feed not cause I want to feed but because I do not want to loose the bee's.  In the wild,,,,,,the bees are in a much smaller space.  maybe if they were in much smaller hives they would do much better left alone?  Course then they would only ever produce what they need an no surplus?   I really don't know but was and maybe still am trying to take this natural then way to far?  If I add a candy board or fondant to each hive they won't take it if they don't need it?!   Then it will be up to them how natural they stay?   This is only my second year with hives and obviously havn't figured out a lot of stuff yet.  Wish me luck!  I will be putting feed on just in case?   Hoping they don't need it but feeling much better if they do that it is there.  Would just be a waist to let them starve trying to produce a 50,000 dollar hive for BJORN,  just kidding there I love your posts BJORN and learn from everyone.     

[Kathyp]

only 4 more months to spring 

but the worst is yet to come   :'(