Did I do the right thing?

Francus · January 24, 2012, 05:14:57 PM

It got warm today so I decided to check on the hives. This is my first winter. The package bees that were delivered way late (another story for another time) did not make it. There were stores left in the hive but the cluster was smaller than a tangerine all surrounding her royal highness. So I removed the dead bees and cut out any wonky comb (I'm foundationless). Maybe I'll make a split in the spring.

Now for the question of did I do the right thing....

The other hive I got from Idee was going strong and flying all over the place so I decided to take a peek. Inside both supers (all medium) were full of bees. I pulled three frames, two from the outside top and one from the middle bottom and all seemed full of stores or uncapped nectar/sugar water. I didn't see any brood.

What I decided to do was put another medium super on top to give them some room to grow. I don't want them being honey bound or swarming since I anticipate a cold snap soon. I used one of the medium supers w/frames from the deadout next door. Probably 6 of the 8 frames were drawn. I then replaced the top feeder and filled it half full with 2:1 sugar water. (or 1:2, I never get that straight, but more sugar than water.)

Was this correct, or am I just worrying too much?

iddee · January 24, 2012, 06:38:43 PM

If the weather stays as it has been for the rest of winter, you did fine.

If we have a week of extreme cold, "10 to 20 F. every night", you likely just killed your hive.

The heat will go to the top and the bees will move up past the food. There, they will freeze.

Francus · January 24, 2012, 07:53:03 PM

Ouch.

I could just as easily remove the top super as it should be warm again tomorrow just to be on the safe side. Although it rarely gets below 20 here.

If I did remove that medium, should I plop it on the very bottom to give expansion room or just leave it off? It was pretty full of bees and I would hate for it to swarm the second a flow starts.

sc-bee · January 24, 2012, 07:56:46 PM

Quote from: iddee on January 24, 2012, 06:38:43 PM
If the weather stays as it has been for the rest of winter, you did fine.

If we have a week of extreme cold, "10 to 20 F. every night", you likely just killed your hive.

The heat will go to the top and the bees will move up past the food. There, they will freeze.

:? Really --- you don't think the bees will stay in a cluster on feed in the bottom chamber? Does the temps vary so much in the top chamber (warmer) that they will leave the food source? My temps don't stay 10-20 for long so I have no idea but I have not had this problem in extended temps of 20-30. But iddee may be closer in temps to you than I.

On a side note not a good time to be breaking apart any frames in the brood chamber or middle fames in bottom box (which possibly could have been some brood). It may be warm in the day but temps in the nights fall and the bees may not have properly clustered from the distrbance on days.

>If we have a week of extreme cold, "10 to 20 F. every night", you likely just killed your hive.
Dang---- if I was the poster I would be wondering what do I do? Try and rush out and undo what I did (remove the empty super)?

Francus--- it would not be hard to just slip the top empty chamber of the hive quickly and return the cover. Based on what I read from above you then would be back to the old configuration plus feed. As for feeding only do so if needed. For me a little further South than you, feeding to boost population usually begins about the 1st or 2nd week of Feb. Our main flow should start in April. One you start feeding continue until thay can fend on their own. If not you will stimulate brood expansion and the extra brood requirements may cause the hive to starve.

Edited- you posted before I could finish pecking :-D

On a side note Francus read some of Walt Wrights writing on Nectar management/ Checkerboarding and see how early he makes his manipulartion. He is located in Tn.

iddee · January 24, 2012, 08:47:05 PM

Bottom supering would be a better bet. That would put the food at the top.

SC, they will work the upper area in the warm day and be caught there come night.

sc-bee · January 24, 2012, 10:41:36 PM

;)

Michael Bush · January 24, 2012, 11:53:26 PM

This isn't the time of year that they grow. They usually expect stores to be either where they left them or overhead. The "happy medium" of room to grow and stores would be to put alternating drawn empty comb and capped stores overhead...

caticind · January 25, 2012, 10:48:08 AM

Just a note on temps. Regardless of whether bees would be trapped in a top super and freeze if the day were warm enough to move, the odds of a cold snap that long near Charlotte are pretty low. Last winter in the Triangle our lowest single night temp was 17. Never had more than 2 consecutive nights below 20, let alone a week.

This winter so far the lowest has been 19 and the long-term forecast calls for it to remain unusually warm. While there may be a snap, I doubt it will be more than a night or two.

sc-bee · January 25, 2012, 11:02:08 AM

Quote from: Michael Bush on January 24, 2012, 11:53:26 PM
This isn't the time of year that they grow. They usually expect stores to be either where they left them or overhead. The "happy medium" of room to grow and stores would be to put alternating drawn empty comb and capped stores overhead...

Sounds a little like Walt's Checker boarding mentioned above ;)

sc-bee · January 25, 2012, 11:03:40 AM

Quote from: caticind on January 25, 2012, 10:48:08 AM
Just a note on temps. Regardless of whether bees would be trapped in a top super and freeze if the day were warm enough to move, the odds of a cold snap that long near Charlotte are pretty low. Last winter in the Triangle our lowest single night temp was 17. Never had more than 2 consecutive nights below 20, let alone a week.

This winter so far the lowest has been 19 and the long-term forecast calls for it to remain unusually warm. While there may be a snap, I doubt it will be more than a night or two.

Kinda my thoughts.........................................

Michael Bush · January 25, 2012, 10:31:31 PM

>Sounds a little like Walt's Checker boarding mentioned above

Exactly.

Francus · January 26, 2012, 09:21:41 AM

Thanks for the input.

I don't know why I didn't think of checkerboarding. That would do the trick I think. I just flipped when I opened it. Tons of bees flying to and fro getting stuff and then the boxes were still stuffed to the max. I should have checked for queen cells, but I didn't want to be in to long. I just checked a few frames to make sure there were stores available and put the frames back where they came from.

bud1 · January 26, 2012, 08:10:18 PM

quit feeding and let the queen get a little space to lay, you said packed full of syrup

sc-bee · January 27, 2012, 01:15:36 AM

No queen cells this time of year in NC ---- not enough drone population. If only you had Queen cells now, iddee would stroke. Imagine the jump you could get on queen producers in Georgia :-D