Changing from Deep to all medium brood boxes

[rufus]

After my first year of beekeeping, I have recognized the benefit of using Mediums but I started my hives with Deeps.  I now have two deep brood boxes and my plan is to place a medium on top of the two deeps.  On this medium, I plan on placing a queen excluder and moving the bottom deep on top of the excluder.  In a week or two I will go back and make sure I didn't move the queen to the top of the excluder.  Would I be able to eliminate both deeps this year or should I over winter in one deep and two mediums?  What do you ya'll think?

[beyondthesidewalks]

I see no reason why you cannot do it but it will cost you honey.

Another approach would be to put the excluder between the two deeps, attempting to exclude the queen from the bottom hive body.  Then when all the brood is hatched out of the bottom deep, remove it and add a medium to the top.  Then repeat with the second hive body.  (Rinse, Lather, Repeat  :-D)  You can feed them the honey from the deeps if necessary to get them to draw all that medium comb or if the season is good enough keep it for yourself.  Freeze those deeps and frames if you're going store them for a while to prevent wax moth or SHB damage.

Good that you're doing it early on.  I've got way too much deep gear to change it now.  Have made the leap to 8 frame.  I'm not getting any younger and my back isn't getting any stronger.

[AllenF]

Personally I would just leave those 2 deeps as brood boxes for now on until you loose the hive.  You can run everything else as medium.    You would just be limited in taking frames from one hive to another.   Medium honey supers are still heavy imo.  That is why I run shallows for honey.   Are you going to cut down your deep frames into med size or sell?   Never over look the value of drawn comb also. 

[rufus]

I've got drawn comb from last year in mediums so the queen can lay right away in the Medium.

[Cadman]

I am no expert, but why not put the medium with drawn comb below the deeps? After they drop down into them you may be able to put a second medium under that. Just a thought,

[FRAMEshift]

To make a quick and painless changeover, I would mix medium and deep frames in the deep boxes (and/or in medium boxes stacked in pairs.)  When the medium frames are mostly drawn, migrate them into medium boxes.  When the deep frames are mostly empty, remove them completely.  If you keep an eye on the frames, this should work well.  If you ignore the frames for too long, you might get some extra comb under the bottom bars on the mediums, but that is easily removed.

[BlueBee]

Personally I like Allen's suggestion; but we beeks are pretty independent in our thinking  :)

Here's another idea/thought for you:  Wait for the colony to be bursting with bees and let them collect spring honey for you.  Then do some aggressive splitting and move most/all of those deep frames into nucs in late June to late July.  Replace all the deeps parts in the original hive with the mediums you want.

At that point you have the original hives in the configuration you want (all mediums) and you have a huge workforce to get ready for winter AND you get a break from the mites in the parent hive since many will go into the nucs with the deep brood frames.  If you then make the nucs raise their own queens, that brood break will cut down on those mites too.

You end up going into winter with your original hives configured in all mediums with a large workforce to build stores for winter.  You also go into winter with 4 deep nucs (or so) which should have time to build up to survive winter too.

Next spring, you have $400 worth of deep nucs to sell to recoup your original investment in deeps!

[rufus]

I don't have very much invested in my deeps, I only have four (I only have two hives).  I was planning on keeping them around for covers for feeders or ???

[BlueBee]

Less invested capital = even greater profits for you  :)

Covers and feeders would work too. 

[FRAMEshift]

I was planning on keeping them around for covers for feeders or ???

Swarm traps!   :-D

[FRAMEshift]

Are you going to cut down your deep frames into med size or sell?   Never over look the value of drawn comb also.  

If you alternate deep and medium frames in deep boxes (and medium boxes stacked in pairs), you get the immediate advantage of having the bees draw new comb in medium frames.  And as Allen says, you can also cut down the deep frames and make medium frames from them so no comb is wasted.

I should also have said above that when you have a deep with mostly capped brood, you can move it up to a higher box out of the brood nest.  When the brood emerges you can remove the frame without having new brood wasted.

[rufus]

Ok, I finally committed myself :shock: I did my first inspection of the year today with temperatures approaching 65 degrees.  Strangely enough I noticed two different situations.  I took both deeps off the screened bottom board on each hive and one screen had cappings and about 6 dead bees on the screen, the other was nearly covered with dead bees.  I had entrance reducers notch side up on both.  Does this mean one hive is more hygenic than the other?  Anyhow, I took with me to the bee yard two mediums with drawn frames and two excluders to do what I proposed in my first post.  On closer observation in both hives I noticed literally no brood, capped or otherwise in the bottom deep and only about half a dozen bees.  Now I am reasonably confident I did the right thing.  I am liking the swarm trap idea.  What do I do to transform those deeps into traps?  Cover both open ends drill a hole (what size) and hang in a tree with lemon grass?

[FRAMEshift]

I am liking the swarm trap idea.  What do I do to transform those deeps into traps?  Cover both open ends drill a hole (what size) and hang in a tree with lemon grass?

Yes, and I would add some queen mandibular pheromone along with the LGO.  Put in some medium frames (drawn if you have them) and some old brood comb for the smell.  I use 1 inch holes.  Nothing much bigger than that.

[beyondthesidewalks]

According to Thomas Seeley, in his book Honeybee Democracy, bees prefer an entrance of 1.25".  I have several traps with 3/4" and 7/8" entrances that have been repeatedly successful.  I don't use comb because it attracts wax moths in my warm climate.  LGO seems to overcome every shortcoming of your swarm traps.  I tried QMP and found no better results.  LGO alone is up to the task in my experience.  Happy trapping.

[BlueBee]

If there was no brood in the bottom deep and queen was not in the bottom deep, why not just remove the whole deep?  That takes care of 1 of the 2 deeps on each hive!  Maybe that is what you did, but I just didn't' read it right.  To answer your original question:  Yes, I think you could cycle out both double deeps this year IF you get enough bees in those hives.  With lots of bees you can do about anything you want.

The smaller is better crowd might enjoy this report.  I wintered my half medium sized mating frames in multiple story nucs this winter.  Wouldn't you know it, but those bees are going gang busters on those small frames this spring!  Bees seem pretty adaptive. 

[Hemlock]

I too am changing over to mediums. 

The current brood nests are in, or have been manipulated into, a single bottom deep; from the double deeps i regularly run.  The top deeps have been removed and will be replaced with mediums as the nest expands.  (the deeps will be cut down to 6 5/8")  Each transition hive will be given medium boxes until they have the 3 to 4 mediums i want them to Winter in.  The bottom deep will be removed as soon as the bees are dominant in the upper mediums.

No honey this year for those hives.  So i do a few each year until complete.

[rufus]

That's just what I did Blue Bee, I just removed the bottom deep and called it good.