Laying Workers

GSF · June 03, 2014, 06:24:16 AM

The only swarm I caught this year is now a laying worker hive. As many as 5 or 6 eggs per cell. I've read two methods on what to do. One is to combine them with a newspaper http://www.ohiostatebeekeepers.org/beekeeping_class/laying-workers-part-1/ and the other is just to shake them out in front of a weak hive.

I'm concerned with the newspaper combine. Seems I've read that the laying worker would try to kill the queen in the queen right hive. Any experience/advice? I'll probably do the shake out after I check once again to make sure the queen isn't just misfiring. About how far off should I shake them?

iddee · June 03, 2014, 07:10:40 AM

I shake them about 10 feet away, then put the hive away, or on another hive.

asprince · June 03, 2014, 08:05:15 AM

I agree with iddee, shake them out. I have tried lots of methods over the years but shaking them out is the least painless and best.

Good Luck,

Steve

Kathyp · June 03, 2014, 11:47:13 AM

shake out.

BeeMaster2 · June 03, 2014, 12:17:03 PM

DITTO.
Shake out. I have lost queens to queenless combines. Thought the bees would protect the queens but they didn't.
I have seen a queen protected from the addition of a queen less hive added to my Observation Hive. They balled her for about 8 hours and then she was OK. It was not a laying worker hive.
Jim

AliciaH · June 03, 2014, 06:24:33 PM

I like using double queen screens. I place the laying worker hive over a queenright hive and let the pheromones do their thing until the laying workers back off. It does take longer, however. Shaking out is a pretty quick solution.

GSF · June 03, 2014, 07:01:52 PM

Thanks gang. If I can pull it off I may do a couple of splits and shake them off in hopes of them going into the splits.

Correct me if I'm wrong - A laying worker can't fly?

sterling · June 03, 2014, 11:37:26 PM

Quote from: GSF on June 03, 2014, 07:01:52 PM
Thanks gang. If I can pull it off I may do a couple of splits and shake them off in hopes of them going into the splits.

Correct me if I'm wrong - A laying worker can't fly?

they can fly. If you want to test it shake um out and leave the hive in the same place.

capt44 · June 04, 2014, 12:39:03 AM

When I find a hive with a laying worker I take the box, with bees, about 100 yards or so away.
I then take each frame and brush or shake the bees off to the ground.
I then put the frame in another box and close it up or put it in a garbage bag and tie it up.
I make sure no bees are in the box.
I take the box back to the original hive location and put the hive back together.
There will bees waiting on me back at the original location, those are the forager bees.
I then wait 24 hours and install a Queen or Queen Cell.

Kathyp · June 04, 2014, 01:15:29 AM

laying workers can fly. that's why you don't want to let them return to the same hive. when they go and join other hives, for some reason, there's no problem.

AliciaH has a good method also. just take a little longer and you can't honey super the hives while you are doing it. if you use her method don't forget to make an opening for the top hive also. you have to be really sure that you have left them on long enough...

that's why i'd rather shake them out, then split the hives later if i want. the bees are not lost and no time is lost. in fact, it gives a boost to the other hives.

GSF · June 04, 2014, 06:38:48 AM

My thinking was to shake them out and put two newly established nucs at the old location. Would that solve the problem or should I leave the old location vacant?

RHBee · June 04, 2014, 09:10:15 AM

Gary; IMO any of these options will work. If you want you can boost the nuc. If nothing is in the old location they will drift to other colonies. If the old hardware is put in the original location, you can do a paper combine with another colony. The choice is yours.

Jim134 · June 04, 2014, 11:42:26 AM

IMHO if you do a newspaper two combined the two hives put the Queen right colony on top and laying workers on the bottom you will have less of a chance of them killing the Queen

BEE HAPPY Jim134 :)

Dallasbeek · June 04, 2014, 11:55:10 AM

A little off topic, but are drones from a laying worker sterile?

marktrl · June 04, 2014, 12:00:09 PM

The 1 time I had a laying worker I fed them til they back filled the combs. Then put in a frame of open brood from another hive a couple of times and it stopped the laying worker. I then was able to give them a new queen. Probably a lot more trouble than a shake out but it worked. I don't like to do shake outs because my hives are fairly close to my house and the 1 time I did a shake to combine bees you couldn't go outside the rest of the day because of angry off bees.

BeeMaster2 · June 04, 2014, 12:47:42 PM

Quote from: Dallasbeek on June 04, 2014, 11:55:10 AM
A little off topic, but are drones from a laying worker sterile?

No, they are no different than drones from a queen. Might/probably are smaller due to the cell size used.
Laying workers use any cell available.
Jim

BeeMaster2 · June 04, 2014, 12:52:06 PM

Quote from: marktrl on June 04, 2014, 12:00:09 PM
The 1 time I had a laying worker I fed them til they back filled the combs. Then put in a frame of open brood from another hive a couple of times and it stopped the laying worker. I then was able to give them a new queen. Probably a lot more trouble than a shake out but it worked. I don't like to do shake outs because my hives are fairly close to my house and the 1 time I did a shake to combine bees you couldn't go outside the rest of the day because of angry off bees.

Did you use a brush to get them off the comb?
That usually gets them really peeved.
If you just shake them off in a grassy area, provides a soft landing, you will probably not have this problem.
Jim

Diogenes · June 05, 2014, 12:08:56 AM

I tried the frame of eggs a week solution. Took 3 weeks until they started building queen cells. Which meant 3 more weeks to the new queen laying, so I continued the donor frames for 2 more weeks to keep the strength up. A frame of eggs and young larvae with nurse bees kept the numbers up. That hive went into winter kind of small and didn't make it. Though last winter was a bit chilly :-\

8-)

Spear · June 05, 2014, 02:01:39 AM

I had a laying worker hive and I saved it by adding some brood from another once then left them alone for a few weeks (4 or 5 weeks) then added some eggs and young lava, then a few weeks later added a lot of capped and emerging brood from another hive - I had also added a virgin queen a while back but I think she was killed as I didn't find her. I think the laying workers had died off or something and they made their own queen from the eggs and they are doing ok now - not really thriving yet but there is good worker brood and their numbers are not declining that I can see from watching the entrance.
Will check them this weekend again to make sure they are still doing well.

Jim134 · June 15, 2014, 05:11:58 AM

Quote from: Dallasbeek on June 04, 2014, 11:55:10 AM
A little off topic, but are drones from a laying worker sterile?

Can you give me any resources or references for this statement ??

BEE HAPPY Jim 134 :)