Going Foundationless

[Jacar]

We have always used wax foundation in our hives. I am taking over my Dad's hives since he passed away. He always put the foundations in.

I have some supers ready but no foundation. What are the pros and cons of no foundation?  I don't have the time or expertise right now to install foundation and I have full boxes on my hives, waiting on some supers.

[Joe D]

My bees seem to like no foundation about as well as wax foundation.  I like to put in a starter strip, I use a paint stirring strip cut into and put in the top of the frame.  You have to keep a check on them to make sure they are building the comb straight.  Once they get it crooked, crossed anything but straight, they will make the rest like that.  I like to put a drawn out frame on each side of the foundationless frame, will help them keep it straight.  Good luck




Joe

[cao]

If you put on an empty foundationless super thinking that they will draw it out correctly, odds are you will end up with a mess.  I tried it last year.  The bees started to draw the comb from the bottom and at an angle to the frames.  I my opinion foundationless is a good choice but you need guides for the bees to follow. In a honey super the bees are not restricted by the raising of brood, so they can get a little wonky when drawing comb.  If you are going foundationless in your super you will also need to provide a "ladder" to get them to the top and prevent them form starting the comb from the bottom.  If you put a frame of two of drawn comb in the middle of your super, it will provide a guide to draw comb and a "ladder" for them to get to the top.

[Jacar]

Thanks for the replies. That helps. I finally got industrious, made the time. and figured out how to install foundation in some supers. So I think that is what I will do as I carry on.

[Kathyp]

i like foundationless because they can draw the size cells they want.  with new boxes, i do think that it helps to have one full sheet or one frame of drawn foundation to start them.  i have not had any major problems with it, but it's important to push the frames tight together in the middle of the box and to correct any mistakes right away.  that's important with foundation also.

until the wax is attached to the sides, it's kind of fragile, so handling takes a little more care at the start.

it saves the buying and inserting of foundation and i am both cheap and lazy  ;-)

[marktrl]

I use foundationless. One thing I've noticed when watching videos of people doing inspections on hives with foundation is they are always dealing with bur comb. I get no bur comb with foundationless. I deal with wacky comb sometimes but no bur comb.

[Michael Bush]

As mentioned, guides and ladders...

http://www.bushfarms.com/beesfoundationless.htm

[ScooterTrash]

2nd year with 2 dozen + colonies foundationless;, if one performs normal inspections, assume one is inspection each 10 days, any cross-comb may be easily managed. It is important the woodenware is level left - right; that would have already been addressed if using oil pans.

[OldMech]

You have gotten some good replies.  You already have drawn comb, so dropping in a foundation-less frame between drawn comb will usually result in a very nice straight foundation-less frame.
   I used to put full boxes of new foundation-less on, but as mentioned, the bees have their own ideas. It is not often difficult to fix, but adding a drawn frame or three to space out the foundation-less will help keep them going in the right direction..
   You may also notice the first frame of foundation-less they draw out will be DRONE comb..  Don't panic, let them get on with it..  Once they have the amount of drones they like they will go back to worker cells...
   Use the drone comb to check for mites.  Once they are done raising drones they will backfill the drone comb with nectar/honey.