Caught a swarm, lost a swarm

tjc1 · May 19, 2016, 08:37:28 PM

I post this as an object lesson for anyone else! Got a swarm call - bees on an exterior bathroom vent (why there??). Scooped em all into an empty cardboard nuc, where they stayed quietly. There were a couple of handfuls I couldn't get, so I covered the box and left the entrance open, figuring that the rest would soon join those in the box. Went home to prep a hive box, came back in an hour to find the bees returning the the vent... Tried recapturing them, but they got irritated and flew off... Grrr... I knew that I should have just taken the box and gone home right away! Or might it have been that I didn't get the queen and they would have failed anyway?

Psparr · May 19, 2016, 08:58:39 PM

I got some good advice the other week. I shook a swarm probably ten times. They kept heading back up to the branch. I did have the queen in the box but the scent must have been just as strong at the branch to draw them back. Sawdustmakr advised to smoke the swarm location heavily and it worked.

divemaster1963 · May 19, 2016, 10:33:47 PM

That or cut the limb off and remove it. Or beequick or bleach on a rag and wipe it. Anything to kill the pheramone on the limb left by the Queen.

John

Psparr · May 19, 2016, 11:08:43 PM

That swarm was over a week ago and still today there's still some flying around that spot.

BeeMaster2 · May 20, 2016, 12:38:19 AM

A friend called me Monday morning and said that he had a large swarm on a branch in his tree. During lunch,we went to his house and I placed a swarm trap up against the swarm for them to go in on their own. They started checking out the box and we had to get back to work. He lives an hour away from me. Late Monday night, I went over there and none were in the box. I wiped the entrance with queen pheromones and lemon grass oil that I had on a Q-tip in a baggy. They started marching in. I went back yesterday to pick them up and they were gone. My buddy said they were all in the box the day before. I suspect the bees figured they needed a larger box and left.
Jim

D Coates · May 20, 2016, 01:56:37 PM

Add a frame of open brood and your chances of losing a swarm drops in the tank. I'm not going to guarantee it but I STRONGLY recommend it. Personally I've never lost a swarm once I put a frame of open brood in there before I shook them in. Put all the effort into catching them to only have them leave? That stinks! I have nucs relatively nearby that I steal a frame of open brood from. One quick shake and all the nurse bees (and possibly queen) are off the frame back in their hive with a replacement frame in there. Drop it in the capture nuc along with 4 undrawn frames and your ready to keep any swarm you catch no matter how much they don't like the size of the box of location.

Case in point I caught a huge swarm 2 weeks ago in a 5 frame box. Clearly the box was too small but it was all I had. I check on them a week later and it was completely drawn out and there were 5-6 active swarm cells in there. A new swarm with active swarm cells, a dead give away they wanted more space but would abandon the brood in there to find it. I added another 5 frames on top and the hive tore down the active queen cells. Had I not had that frame of brood in there I would have undoubtedly lost that swarm.

tjc1 · May 20, 2016, 10:12:25 PM

Great advice, everyone. I, too, thought they had decided that the box was too small. But even when the swarm left there were bees left behind, hugging that spot on the wall where the swarm had been - didn't realize that so much pheromone would be left behind during a short stay.

DCoates - how long can the open brood last on its own like that, uncovered/untended by nurse bees? Your story was a great example of their dedication to tending open brood.

D Coates · May 23, 2016, 12:57:44 PM

Quote from: tjc1 on May 20, 2016, 10:12:25 PMDCoates - how long can the open brood last on its own like that, uncovereduntended by nurse bees? Your story was a great example of their dedication to tending open brood.

I've had them exposed more than 5 hours and it was during warm weather only 2 weeks ago. The only reason I had it exposed that long was my OB hive swarmed but then returned before I could catch them. I left the box with brood at the swarm spot (shade) in a nuc box unattended from 12 to 5. At 5 I stole two frames of brood and the queen that was trying to swarm. I looked at that frame of brood this weekend and saw no patches of brood that had died due to this unattended time. When I get a call on a swarm I head to one of my donor nucs and grab a frame of brood give a firm shake back into the box and I'm gone. It takes about 5 minutes and I normally have a swarm on them within 30 minutes. If I'm not near any brood I can steal (I travel with nuc catch boxes and frames) I go ahead and catch the swarm and move them to a nearby location that has brood I can steal. They take to that just fine though I do not like disturbing them that 2nd time by stealing an outer frame and putting the brood frame in the middle.