When to add a second brood box?

[Nyleve]

So I got my nuc two weeks ago. They look fine and I have them in a single deep box with lots of drawn comb. They aren't yet working to the outside frames - just looked today and they're still in the middle 4 original nuc frames plus filling some of the nearby frames with sugar water (I assume) because I've been feeding them. How do I know when to add a second brood box? This is my first new nuc after 5 years with the same colony so I'm not sure I know what to do.

For what it's worth, I found the queen (!) and there's lots of capped brood and new larvae in the middle frames. I'm just so happy to have seen my queen that it made my day,

[Psparr]

Take an outside frame and put it between two brood frames. When that's full of brood do it again. You should wait till there's bees covering most of the frames. Too much space for the bees to police is not good.

[BeeMaster2]

80% drawn is the rule of thumb but if you are watching them build, I wait until they are working on the outer frames and have lots of bees that are ready to move up.
Jim

[Acebird]

if this was actually a nuc and you installed it with drawn frames I would not be feeding it sugar water.  But that is me.

[bwallace23350]

I took the advice of several people on the boards and put on my second box when the first one had 8 full frames and lots of bees on top. Have a brush handy to move them off the sides of the box so you do not kill a bunch of bees.

[Nyleve]

I filled the box with drawn comb when I installed the nuc they don't have any building to do. Next time I open the hive, I may move one of the outside frames to the middle - that seems like a good idea. I will quit feeding them after this jar - I'm just being an overprotective mother I guess. I wanted to make sure they have a good start. Will add a second box once they are really covering the outside frames. Suppose I shouldn't be in a hurry about this. Thanks for the comments.

[Acebird]

I may move one of the outside frames to the middle - that seems like a good idea.

Who suggested that?

[Nyleve]

Take an outside frame and put it between two brood frames. When that's full of brood do it again.

Is this not a good idea?

[Acebird]

There are a whole bunch of conditions to consider.  Is this outside frame empty, full of drones, honey, pollen or foundationless?  If it were empty or foundationless and warm enough I don't see a problem although I consider it a waste of time and a needless intervention.

[Psparr]

If it's drawn worker cell it gives the Queen a place to lay, boosting your population. In turn giving your hive more workers to help work the honey super you want to put on.

[Acebird]

IMO the only thing holding back the queen in a new hive from laying to her capacity is the population of nurse bees to prepare and care for brood (assuming adequate food).  So if your goal is to expand the hive faster then add nurse bees.  Adding drawn comb doesn't gain you more bees as much as it gains you honey because they don't consume it drawing the comb out.

[Psparr]

If you put that drawn comb in the brood nest the Queen is apt to lay. If it's his only hive I think he'll be hard pressed to find nurse bees to put in there.

[Acebird]

The box is full of drawn comb.  The queen can lay anywhere.  Any intervention into the brood nest will set them back.  Adding bees is an intervention but it will gain more than shifting frames around in the box.  If he cannot add the bees then set and watch but don't touch.  Feeding is an intervention too.  It works when they need it.  If they don't need it it is another net lose.  The OP has had bees for 5 years.  Yes, it is an assumption on my part but he might have more than one hive.

[Nyleve]

First, I'm a she  and second, I do only have one hive. I know all the reasons why I should have more than one, but I am trying to remain sane and so am curbing my enthusiasm to a point that I can handle.

I am going to stay out of it for now. Of course you always want to do something to help but sometimes, I realize, the best kind of help is just staying out of the way. Will take the feed away when they finish this batch and leave them alone. When they seem to be filling the box closer to the outside frames, I will put on a second box.

Thanks everyone. Its hard doing nothing.

[GSF]

Nyleve, How much longer before cold weather sets in? That's another thing to consider. I use to put empty frames in the middle of the brood nest - I don't now. I'll take the last outside drawn frame, move it over one and place an empty between it and the brood nest. I think that's a better way to go. Next year I could go back to doing it the way I use to. Right now I'm not. Beekeeping is a learning process keep up the good work.

[Acebird]

Sorry about the he, she thing but if you want to maintain one hive you should find a friend (and that could be he or she) who has hives that can help you solve a real problem when it occurs.  If all you want is one hive I don't understand "Its hard doing nothing."  With one hive there is barely anything to do.

[Nyleve]

Nyleve, How much longer before cold weather sets in?

Ha! It just got warm! Cold weather starts in October around here. Let's not get crazy.

And yes I do have a couple of friends with bees so I'm not completely alone when things go wonky. But my last colony hung in there for 5 years so I've had good luck, mostly.

You're right with one hive there's not much to do but that's ok. I do other stuff too.

[Caribou]

Nyleve, I think he means that with multiple hives there are more things to do to help out a slow hive like steal a frame of brood or drawn comb.

[Nyleve]

Right. Got it. I put on the second box yesterday - all looks well in the hive. They were all over the outer frames in the first box, so I figured it was time.

[Oldbeavo]

I would leave it until they start building in the lid, which says they are looking for more room. Nucs don't get a hive until they put honey in the lid and the single hive doesn't get a super until there is honey in the lid.
They tell you we need more room.