Is this normal? (update - 05/07/06)

[Hi-Tech]

OK… This was my first real good inspection of my new hive that was installed as a 3 lb package 2 ½ weeks ago. I could not find my marked queen (I saw her at the one week inspection) and I looked real good. I have almost no brood (I can see maybe 60 larvae on one side of one frame) and almost no capped brood (About the same as the larvae).

It also appears to be a lot fewer bees than what came in the package.

Very little comb is even drawn out!

Do I re-queen immediately?

Am I over reacting? The bees are coming and going like normal and bringing in pollen.....

Emergency advice is needed!

I also found several big cockroaches in the hive. Is that normal for here in the south?

HELP!

http://www.greenlynk.com/DCP02034.JPG

[manowar422]

Some more info will help us answer. . .
What type of frames do you have? Trying spraying sugar water
on them. This sometimes helps get them started.
Have you smoked the hive prior to inspection? Sometimes this
makes the queen run and hide. I had to look last week without
smoke. I then found all three queens easialy.
Are you feeding a 1:1 mixture of sugar water to simulate a nectar
flow? If little or no nectar is coming in, it's hard for them to draw comb.

[Hi-Tech]

I added a pic to the post...

Wood frames with plastic foundation coated in beeswax...
I have not tried spraying them with sugar water...

I did smoke before inspection...

I took the feeder off because we have lots of nectar now and they stopped using the syrup.

[Hi-Tech]

http://www.greenlynk.com/DCP02034.JPG
The frame is upside down in pic

This was the only frame with any brood and only on one side.

That is what has me worried...

How much brood should i have by now?

[manowar422]

Alot more than that :shock:
You must inspect every frame without smoke and make
darn sure your queenless first.
While inspecting and looking for the queen, look closely
for single eggs laid in the bottom of any cells. That's a
sure sign she was there in the last 24 hours.
(I use a magnifying glass cuz my eyes are goin')
After that, take off any boxes that you would consider
"excess room". They can't defend a large space with
reduced population numbers, that's probably
why you spotted the roach in the hive.
The remaining bees will raise a new queen if they have
a larva that has not yet been started on foods other
than royal jelly. I'm not sure but I think I remember
reading that the larva cannot be over 3 days old, but
don't hold me to that. FIND THAT QUEEN!

[Hi-Tech]

OK.... another rookie mistake....

I figgured it has been severl hours since I was in the hive so I just went for another look with no smoke. Either smoke really calms bees or they were still upset about my last visit but either way they were not pleased to be opened up again!

Anyway, I still could not find a queen. What happens if I buy and insert a queen while i still have one?

Is it better to go ahead and get one and be safe?

[Jerrymac]

One queen, probably the new one, will be killed.

I haven't seen that smoke does much. When they are calm they don't need the smoke, when they are aggitated the smoke doesn't seem to help.

[Hi-Tech]

So... by looking at the pic I posted, does it look like if I even have a queen, she is not doing what she is supposed to be doing? Should I order a queen?

[BEE C]

heres a picture of my average frame started from a four pound package at almost the same time as you up here.  I would requeen or at the very least throw your feeder back in it can stimulate brood production.  I still have mine in (frame feeder) which they drain every three days.  Of course it is a lot colder up here at this time of the year.  Seven of nine frames are covered both sides.

[Finsky]

http://www.greenlynk.com/DCP02034.JPG

I may se that real queen has made some eggs. Bees are very few if this is your normal frame?

It may be that queen has been sick and it has died. But it is died there should be emergengy queen cells on frames, even starts.

When queen get bad nosema, it's egg laying is  like in picture. After a while it ceases all. Queen may die and bees carry it out.   I have read that nosema is common  in package hives.

If you have another package hive, it should be better put bees together with that hive.

[Jack Parr]

Others have pretty much covered your bee problem so I'll tip you off on the roaches.

Yes, we in the south are fortunate to have an abundance of roaches. If you place your hive over, or, near an area with dead, or, an accumulation of dead vegatation such as leaves, weeds, grasses etc, there will be roaches in there and they will quickly find their way into the hive. Roaches thrive in dark, dank,  locations and are a fact of life.  I find them in my hives but not many or often. I can't say that the bees clean them out because, well, I find them alive. I clean them out.
         
The package contains bees of different ages whenever they are packaged at the supplier.  The package guys remove frames of whatever from their boxes, with clinging bees, and " shake the bees off " into a funnel and then they fall into that screened box that you received them in. Bees of all ages and since they usually last about six weeks the population can diminish rapidly at first. Then if the queen is up to snuff there should be a rapid build-up shortly after.

With so few bees, as you indicate, you should be able to find your queen
if she is there.

[Michael Bush]

Some queens take two weeks to really start to lay.  Then it takes four days for the eggs to hatch.  I wouldn't panic if you're seeing open brood you HAVE a queen.  Give her another week and see what it looks like.

Sometimes the package places have banked the queen for some time and it takes her a while to get fattened back up to laying well.

[Hi-Tech]

Thanks all,

I think I am going to put the feeder back in place and leave it alone for a week to ten days. Then I will take another look and see what I have. Thanks for the advice. I really appreciate it!

[Finsky]

I think I am going to put the feeder back in place and leave it alone for a week to ten days. !

If bees get honey from nature, you do not need feeder.

How much you have space for bees?  3 lbs bees occupy about 5 frames.

[Hi-Tech]

1 week later and things look much better. I went into the hive today and while I still could not find the queen, I saw lots of brood. Yeah! Thanks for teaching me a little patience.....

2 quick questions... One, I have a marked queen. Can she lose her mark or is she just hiding real well?

Two, My hive is is a single deep body right now. Most of the frames are drawn except for 3. Two on one far side and one on the other far side are not 100% complete and have nothing in the cells yet. Is it time to add the second hive body?

[Apis629]

If the bees are HIGHLY hygenic they may manage to chew off parts of the mark but, my queen at over a year still has most of the mark.

Wait untill all the frames are drawn and the bees are using at least  7 of them.  Then, provided there's a honeyflow (natural or artificial), begin adding the second hive body.

But, how bad are your winters?  That far south I bet you don't even need a second hive body.  Here in Florida, most beekeepers use only one deep for the hive body and everything else is supers for honey but, one medium is left on over the winter.  Speaking of which, the Palm flow just started and the bees are going to town!