What did you do in your Apiary/Bee yard today?

[The15thMember]

That sounds right to me.  This is the thing about overwintering nucs, if I understand it correctly anyway: you will have to feed them all winter, because there is no way for them to put up the stores they need.  I'm also not sure, with their extremely limited space, what is the appropriate timing for encouraging them to backfill the brood nest with syrup.  You don't want them to swarm if your winter weather is slow in coming, nor do you want them to have the frames clogged with syrup too early and then have them not raise enough winter bees.  But you also want them to be as packed full of food as possible and if they have nothing at all right now and your nectar flow is weak, they could potentially even starve without feed.  It seems tenuous to me, but I've never done it.  Can someone who has actually overwintered nucs offer some advice here?   

[Terri Yaki]

I sent the video to my mentor and he suggests that I feed the nuc 1:1 and assess the situation mid September.

[The15thMember]

I think that sounds like a good course of action.  The 1:1 should keep them brood rearing, and they should store it a little slower than 2:1. 

[beesnweeds]

I sent the video to my mentor and he suggests that I feed the nuc 1:1 and assess the situation mid September.

It's too late for 1:1. The nuc won't have enough time to dry out the syrup and will create too much moisture in the colony, feed 2:1.  I would kill the queen in your primary hive and 24 hours later combine one deep with the swarm hive and the full medium.  That queen (brood pattern) looks pretty good in the swarm colony.  Make one nice colony to overwinter.  Honestly, that nuc probably isn't going to overwinter or at least here it wouldn't.  I overwinter in 5 over 5 nucs, no feeding necessary.

[The15thMember]

It's too late for 1:1. The nuc won't have enough time to dry out the syrup and will create too much moisture in the colony, feed 2:1.

Terri, beesnweeds's climate is likely closer to yours than mine, so this is a valid concern.  In my area we are looking at another 2-2.5 months of flying weather, but you likely are not, something I wasn't considering.   

I would kill the queen in your primary hive and 24 hours later combine one deep with the swarm hive and the full medium.  That queen (brood pattern) looks pretty good in the swarm colony.  Make one nice colony to overwinter.  Honestly, that nuc probably isn't going to overwinter or at least here it wouldn't.  I overwinter in 5 over 5 nucs, no feeding necessary.

Another option would be to recombine the nuc with the primary hive.  Beesnweeds, if Terri wanted to, do you think he has enough time left to feed the nuc up to 5 over 5?     

[beesnweeds]

Another option would be to recombine the nuc with the primary hive.  Beesnweeds, if Terri wanted to, do you think he has enough time left to feed the nuc up to 5 over 5?   

If he had 5 fully drawn out deep frames they could possibly store enough.  He may be better off just putting a block of bakers fondant above the inner cover.

[cao]

I always say that I will combine small hives in the fall, but somehow, I never do.  I just let nature take its course.  I am always surprised when those small hives make it.  I haven't fed my bees sugar in at least 3 or 4 years.  Last winter it was a 10-frame medium hive that made it.  They are usually some of the first hives that need boxes added in the spring.

I sent the video to my mentor and he suggests that I feed the nuc 1:1 and assess the situation mid September.

Around here we have at least 2 months of flying weather so when I used to feed it would usually be the end of september when I really started and then it would be the thickest sugar water I could make.

[Terri Yaki]

I sent the video to my mentor and he suggests that I feed the nuc 1:1 and assess the situation mid September.

It's too late for 1:1. The nuc won't have enough time to dry out the syrup and will create too much moisture in the colony, feed 2:1.  I would kill the queen in your primary hive and 24 hours later combine one deep with the swarm hive and the full medium.  That queen (brood pattern) looks pretty good in the swarm colony.  Make one nice colony to overwinter.  Honestly, that nuc probably isn't going to overwinter or at least here it wouldn't.  I overwinter in 5 over 5 nucs, no feeding necessary.

Thanks for taking the time to review it and your approach sounds solid. I don't know where you are in the Adirondacks but my camp up north is about four weeks ahead of us here with the turn of the seasons. My mentor and class teachers are adamantly still pushing 1:1 but I don't know why, I'm still trying to sort that out. They are rearing brood right now so it is possible that 1:1 would be used for feeding them immediately? My mentor recommends assessing the situation in mid September and combining things then. I guess that in the meantime, I'll stuff them with as much syrup as I can.

Thanks again.

[beesnweeds]

I don't know where you are in the Adirondacks but my camp up north is about four weeks ahead of us here with the turn of the seasons.

Thats sounds right, I just figure the sooner hives are prepared for winter the better off they will be.

My mentor and class teachers are adamantly still pushing 1:1.

I'm not sure why either.  Flowers don't produce 1:1 nectar in the spring and 2:1 in the fall.  Water to sugar content in flowers is all over the place. For whatever reason most beekeepers believe 1:1 produces more brood and 2:1 is stored and maybe that's the case in southern states, I don't know.  My bees want the carbs, so they are fine with 2:1 anytime and can collect water if they want.  I never saw any difference between hives fed different ratios except for fall when it's harder for them to dry 1:1. Wet nectar or syrup can remain uncapped after the first frost causing moisture issues.

[Terri Yaki]

I was wondering if thicker syrup would bother them. Ill see how things look this week and maybe switch some of to 2:1.

[Terri Yaki]

If I put one jar of each in the hives, will they pick which one they want?

[The15thMember]

If I put one jar of each in the hives, will they pick which one they want?

Only one way to find out.  My hypothesis is they will prefer the 2:1, because they know it will be less work to dry.   

My mentor and class teachers are adamantly still pushing 1:1.

I agree that this is very strange and not typical.  Maybe ask you mentor or someone at your club about it next time you have the opportunity, because I've honestly never heard anyone advocate for thinner syrup in the fall. 

[beesnweeds]

If I put one jar of each in the hives, will they pick which one they want?

They don't care, bees are hoarders and will take all the sugar they can get.  Thats why we are able to take some honey and leave enough for the winter most years. 2:1 is just easier for them to cap sooner for winter stores.  If cold weather kicks in before they have a chance to dry and cap honey or sugar syrup it could ferment so they won't be able to use it.

I've honestly never heard anyone advocate for thinner syrup in the fall. 

Agree, I've never heard that as well.

[Lesgold]

Just finished an early season check on about a dozen hives. All queens are in build up mode and laying with 4 to 6 frames of brood in most hives. A bit of drone brood is showing up with the odd drone walking on combs. Did alcohol wash tests on 10 hives for negative results. Nice to know that there may be a little more time before the work rate increases due to the arrival of the pest. White wax is just starting to show near top bars on some of the frames. Plenty of pollen present with some nectar coming in to support the youngsters as they grow.

[Lesgold]

Just finished checking 6 hives in another location. All varroa free at this stage. Replaced all bottom boards and manipulated frames and boxes as required. This is the hottest pre spring weather I?ve ever experienced. The bees are loving it and all flowering plants are scratching their heads wondering what the heck is going on. A couple of days ago it hit 29C which is crazy for winter. I sure Max will be getting even hotter weather as he is over 1000km north of me.

[Terri Yaki]

Swarm hive guzzled two quarts of 1:1 in less than two days so last night I gave them a quart of 1:1 and one of 2:1 to see what happens. this morning I looked and both jars are almost 1/2 empty already and the 1:1 is just a tad lower than the 2:1. This could be due to size and number of holes in the lid. They seem to like something about that empty box on top with the feeders in it, they're hanging out all over in there.

[NigelP]

Just finished extracting the last of my summer blossom honey today. Phew,  that's one job over and done with for this year.
Tomorrow I go and see how the girls have done on the heather. Last I looked they were pouring it in, so expecting good things .
Year end is in sight....bring back heather honey, press out heather honey. Bring back hives to home apiaries.
Treat all hives for varroa and make preparations for winter feeding of thick syrup.
Will have to pop to wholesalers for a couple of hundred kilos of sugar.
Then time for a holiday. Yippee.

[Ben Framed]

Your busy! Nigel which honey do you use for your softest honey as your featured in the Original Post here on this topic?

[NigelP]

Ben for the soft set honeys I usually use our spring honeys which are usually quite quick to set due to Oil seed rape (Canola), so not good to sell to customers as "runny" honey. But as we have had a crap spring harvest this season it will probably be made with early summer blossom this year. I've found with UK honeys it doesn't really matter what you use, as long as you have a good seed to add to the runny. It makes a good use of honeys that I can't sell as runny.

[Terri Yaki]

Inspected my Hive #1 and nuc today and now it is definitely time to merge. I moved stuff around in the main hive and had one frame of life that I put in the upper box, where I will put the nuc colony. My thoughts are to lift that box off, shake all bees off of that frame into the lower box, lay newspaper down and put the five frames of bees from the nuc plus the frame of brood that's there plus four frames of drawn come from my no longer needed swarm trap. That will fill everything up and give them room to store more honey. Mentor says that with paper merge, no waiting after killing queen is necessary. Wax moths have just started to set up camp in the swarm trap so those frames are in the freezer right now. Any corrections or advice are welcome.

In addition to spotty brood in the main hive, I found something that my mentor says looks like European foul brood. In this picture, it's just below and left of center. He makes it sound like it's not a contagious phenomenon but I don't know. What should I do about this? He mentioned maybe calling our state bee inspector and have him come take a look.