New Hive

[bwallace23350]

I am thinking of getting a third hive. Should I try to catch a swarm, get Carnolians, or Russian Hybrids? Mine current ones started off Italians but who knows what they have mated with over time. Our wild bees tend to be much darker than pure Italians.

[Terri Yaki]

Is splitting one of yours not an option?

[bwallace23350]

I guess I could split my hives if need be.

[The15thMember]

The first step to answering this question is why do you want a 3rd hive?  What are your goals?  Do you like the bees you have?  If you are happy with the traits your current two hives possess, then I'd would just split them.  If you'd like to maybe try some bees that are a little bit different, than a swarm or some "purebreds" of a different strain might be the way to go.  Of course a swarm or a split is free, and a package, nuc, or queen costs money, so that needs to be considered as well. 

[iddee]

In your situation, I would not recommend Russians. The grapevine says Russians are great for a generation or two, then each natural requeening, they get meaner. After 3 or 4 years, they are meaner than Africanized.

[Kathyp]

I am always in favor of free bees. You can always put yourself on a swarm catch list and see what spring brings. If you don't get anything early you should still have time to buy a nuc or split a hive. You guys get swarms early if you are down in the warm part.

[beesnweeds]

Russians are great, even after many generations.  They overwinter great and have less disease issues than any other bees I've ever had.  Thats all I have in my apiary.  If they are meaner than africanized bees it's because someone one crossed them with Africans.  Same can be said for Italians or Carns.

[iddee]

They don't have to be crossed with Africans. They can be crossed with Italians or any others.  When they are no longer full Russians is when they turn mean.

[beesnweeds]

I've been keeping Russian mutts since 2010. Someone forgot to tell them to get mean.  Including other beekeepers I know.

[iddee]

In beekeeping, there is no0 rule that is 100%. There will always be exceptions.

[beesnweeds]

Exactly!

[Michael Bush]

My experience with Russians is that they survived huge mite loads, they would pull hair and follow forever.

[bwallace23350]

The goal of this new hive is to have a hive I don't have to treat for mites. I treat my Italian mutts and want to get to where I don't have to treat. I have read Russians and Carny's are more mite resistance. I have also heard that wild bees could be hygienic survivor bees.

[The15thMember]

The thing about catching feral bees is that they have to actually be feral stock for you to get the benefit of their naturally selected genetics.  If you have a lot of other beekeepers around you, chances are a swarm is from someone else's colony. 

I'm working towards minimal/no treating and there is no easy answer there.  I've got local mutts, and I'm just slowly selecting for what I want in my apiary, but for me at least, it's proving to be a long game, although I have seen some improvement already.  A more resistant strain could be worth a try, but just know there is no silver bullet for mites, or we'd all be using it.   

[Michael Bush]

All my Russians survived higher mite loads than the Italains, Buckfasts, SMR (now VHS) etc. but they died eventually from the mites without treatment while on large cell foundation.  None were surviving until I got them on natural cell size or small cell size.  The local mutts survived the winter better than any of those.

[bwallace23350]

I used to have beekeepers around me but they moved a year ago or so. There are none that I know of anymore near me. What ever I do catch will be from I guess feral wild stock  that survived the year.

[Ben Framed]

Without beekeepers, I don't believe there would be honey bees in my area. SHB alone are simply too much for them to overcome without aid. 🤷🏻‍♂️
When I was a boy feral hives were readily found. Not now, and if found they don't last.

[Michael Bush]

I've had feral bees around all the time until one year when the pesticides wiped out all the bees.  Hey survive everything except new badly timed pesticide spraying.

[bwallace23350]

I should try to catch some out of my old orchard. It has had feral bees living for years there. Not sure where but their are always honeybees floating around

[beesnweeds]

I should try to catch some out of my old orchard.

If you catch swarms or buy bees and don't treat them for mites the important thing is to at least learn how to test for mites and recognize their effects.  If you have a high mite count in August, you can be sure why the colony didn't collect enough stores or raise enough healthy winter bees. Do some research on how to inspect dead outs for mite damage and diseases.